E15 and 93 octane question

[SHOdded]

What's the confusion, Elven?  What's getting you stuck?

1.  Octane is not synonymous with power.  Octane is the ability of the fuel to resist knock/detonation.
2.  Gasoline is more energy dense than ethanol.  So that means that to take advantage of the added octane that ethanol provides, your fuel pump has to be able to pump more volume than if it were pumping pure gasoline.  IE the headroom FoMoCoSHO spoke of.
3.  There are reliability issues with the seals inside any fuel system.  That's why the spec is there - up to E15, up to E20 etc.  Ethanol is more corrosive than gasoline, so the same seal you use for pure gasoline won't work so well in a mixed gasoline/ethanol environment.  Every design is built with a limit in mind.

[FoMoCoSHO]

I'd use the straight gas topped off with corn using the calculator to get your desired blend.

But why blend to make e15 when I can just get e15 at the pump? Thats the whole reason I am confused, is it better to get 93 octane and blend e85 or is it same as getting e15? I dont want to blow up my car lol.

If our cars were gonna blow up from a little corn, Wassinger and I would be hoofin it right now, lol....

Personally I would blend to E30 with the straight gas, tune and datalog from there.

e30 on an 2011? Also the pump has the option for e30 so i shouldnt have to blend. God this ethanol stuff is confusing.

Hah, the devil is always in the details....

Ok, I wouldn't start at E30 with a 2011.

I'd start with straight gas and blend to e15 then slowly see what your system will tolerate from there....

[ElvenSho]

What's the confusion, Elven?  What's getting you stuck?

People recommending i datalog e30 even tho I have a 2011. Than kthe other guy saying to blend instead of just pump on a pump that has e15, etc. The biggest thing is if this will be benefitial since the fuel pressure will end up dropping and Torrie wont be able to push the system as far?

[FoMoCoSHO]

The only difference in your fuel system is the low pressure pump.

Since I've never had a gen 4.1 to play with, I don't know exactly how much that changes the corn tolerance....

So....slow and steady till Torrie gets you dialed in.

Straight gas is the better option but it takes a little more work.

Once you do it a few times, its no biggie.

Do you run Torque?

It will show you real time fuel level which helps calculate your blend on the fly.

Keep in mind, unless you are on the ragged edge of fuel volume, being perfectly exact isn't necessary as the adaptives will trim it out for you. If you are on the ragged edge and screw up during the coldest part of winter, the ECM will step in and protect itself. At least that was my experiences....

[ElvenSho]

The only difference in your fuel system is the low pressure pump.

Since I've never had a gen 4.1 to play with, I don't know exactly how much that changes the corn tolerance....

So....slow and steady till Torrie gets you dialed in.

Straight gas is the better option but it takes a little more work.

Once you do it a few times, its no biggie.

Do you run Torque?

It will show you real time fuel level which helps calculate your blend on the fly.

Keep in mind, unless you are on the ragged edge of fuel volume, being perfectly exact isn't necessary as the adaptives will trim it out for you. If you are on the ragged edge and screw up during the coldest part of winter, the ECM will step in and protect itself. At least that was my experiences....

So your saying straight gas is better, is it even worth me trying to do anything different than the 93 octane tune I have. I dont want to waste mine or Torries time.

[SHOdded]

I wouldn't get caught up in the details too much unless a migraine is the desired goal LOL

Basically, the only way to KNOW what blend is REALLY in your tank is to mix your own. 

Skip to the practical part.   Since your Shell station has premixed blends, just use those to start.  Fillup when your SHO's gas tank is as low as possible, and about the same each time.  Then fill E15 to the top for first round of testing.  Run down your tank of E15.  If the datalogs are good, next fillup with E20.  And repeat this process with higher E blends until you start losing performance.  Then dial back to the next lower E blend and test it extensively.

[ElvenSho]

I wouldn't get caught up in the details too much unless a migraine is the desired goal LOL

Basically, the only way to KNOW what blend is REALLY in your tank is to mix your own. 

Skip to the practical part.   Since your Shell station has premixed blends, just use those to start.  Fillup when your SHO's gas tank is as low as possible, and about the same each time.  Then fill E15 to the top for first round of testing.  Run down your tank of E15.  If the datalogs are good, next fillup with E20.  And repeat this process with higher E blends until you start losing performance.  Then dial back to the next lower E blend and test it extensively.

My head already hurts haha. i will follow your directions, thanks!

[FoMoCoSHO]

The only difference in your fuel system is the low pressure pump.

Since I've never had a gen 4.1 to play with, I don't know exactly how much that changes the corn tolerance....

So....slow and steady till Torrie gets you dialed in.

Straight gas is the better option but it takes a little more work.

Once you do it a few times, its no biggie.

Do you run Torque?

It will show you real time fuel level which helps calculate your blend on the fly.

Keep in mind, unless you are on the ragged edge of fuel volume, being perfectly exact isn't necessary as the adaptives will trim it out for you. If you are on the ragged edge and screw up during the coldest part of winter, the ECM will step in and protect itself. At least that was my experiences....

So your saying straight gas is better, is it even worth me trying to do anything different than the 93 octane tune I have. I dont want to waste mine or Torries time.

No, what I'm saying is 93 straight gas mixed with e-85 is better than fuel oxygenated to 93 at the refinery.

You have the luxury of a choice i don't have.

On an almost empty tank, I would add 3 gallons of e-85 then top off with the straight 93. (15% ish)

From there, each additional gallon adds approximately 5%...4 gal=20%, 5=25%, and so on.

[ElvenSho]

The only difference in your fuel system is the low pressure pump.

Since I've never had a gen 4.1 to play with, I don't know exactly how much that changes the corn tolerance....

So....slow and steady till Torrie gets you dialed in.

Straight gas is the better option but it takes a little more work.

Once you do it a few times, its no biggie.

Do you run Torque?

It will show you real time fuel level which helps calculate your blend on the fly.

Keep in mind, unless you are on the ragged edge of fuel volume, being perfectly exact isn't necessary as the adaptives will trim it out for you. If you are on the ragged edge and screw up during the coldest part of winter, the ECM will step in and protect itself. At least that was my experiences....

So your saying straight gas is better, is it even worth me trying to do anything different than the 93 octane tune I have. I dont want to waste mine or Torries time.

No, what I'm saying is 93 straight gas mixed with e-85 is better than fuel oxygenated to 93 at the refinery.

You have the luxury of a choice i don't have.

On an almost empty tank, I would add 3 gallons of e-85 then top off with the straight 93. (15% ish)

From there, each additional gallon adds approximately 5%...4 gal=20%, 5=25%, and so on.

Understood. Sometimes I feel like people have to draw things for me when it comes to cars haha.

[ZSHO]

I would personaly just leave it alone for now until after you see your results at the track this weekend,if needed you can start focusing and preparing on exactly whats needed in the mixture,basicaly dont ruin a good thing you have. Z

[ElvenSho]

I would personaly just leave it alone for now until after you see your results at the track this weekend,if needed you can start focusing and preparing on exactly whats needed in the mixture,basicaly dont ruin a good thing you have. Z

I have a 3/4 of a tank of gas left, i will not fill up e15 until sometimes next week so this weekend i will run the car the way it sits. I might have H&R springs installed depending if the come in before the weekend tho.

[ElvenSho]

Ok so now I have another question. The website I was provided earlier shows the ethanol % but it depends on what fuel was used to blend it can depend on what octane rating we get. For example e85 mixed with 87 is octane rating 90 while mixed with 93 is octane rating 95... I guess I got to check with the gas station if they mix e85 with 93 to get e15 or something else.

[FoMoCoSHO]

Honestly, I've never seen a blend pump before but I assume the octane numbers are still posted on them.

You need to know alcohol content and octane of your base fuel to use that calculator properly.

[ElvenSho]

Honestly, I've never seen a blend pump before but I assume the octane numbers are still posted on them.

You need to know alcohol content and octane of your base fuel to use that calculator properly.

Just went to the pump and spoke to the owner and got a pic of what they have. He said they blend e85 with straight gas 87 octane to get the other ratings of ethanol. So for e15 i am looking at around 90 octane or so which is worse than straight gas 93 for performance so not even worth experimenting unless i mix my own e85 and 93. Here is actually what they offer I was a bit off on some of the offerings.

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[SHOdded]

Ok, so use the link I provided early on in this thread.  Use the calculator at the bottom of that linked page to see how much you need to mix.  Mix the requisite straight 93 and E85.  Datalog.  Done!