Quote from: ZSHO on May 27, 2016, 07:29:26 PM

Quote from: dr.dodge on May 27, 2016, 07:02:04 PM

Quote from: ZSHO on May 27, 2016, 05:26:35 PM

Quote from: sholxgt on May 27, 2016, 05:08:31 PM

Quote from: mval on May 27, 2016, 04:56:27 PM
mine didn't get rejected based on o2 sensor, as lme doesn't turn off atleast i don't think so, but the p1000 dtc- readiness code.actually didn't get an engine problem lights.

My research leads me to believe that LMS tunes turn off the rear sensors.  Would love to know if I'm wrong though. 

I also believe their catted downpipes will trigger the CEL otherwise.  The cat's they use are a race type that are good for performance, but not quite clean enough to satisfy the factory programming.

PPE Catted DP from www.ecopowerparts.com are the only DP that will pass emissions testing if required by your individual State,other DP are for off-road use.  Z

So other manufacturers downpipes (livernois or unleashed) won't pass emission even if returned to a stock tune?

I'm pretty sure they both state for "Off road use"only,correct me if i'm wrong.  Z

I have no idea. I will be buying downpipes soon and wanted to know for sure before the purchase.

I think you would be able to pass emissions with catted downpipes as long as a) you are on the stock tune, b) the rear O2s are turned on, and c) the drive cycle is complete.

As long as the cats are as efficient as stock...but thats a conundrum...if they flow more then they arent as efficient at removing the emmissions.....if they flow less then they are very efficient....cant have both

The ppe most likely flow a little more and are just barely efficient enough not to throw a cel

I wouldnt buy any down pipe if you are worried about monitor readiness

Even a 50 state legal cat wont gaurantee monitor readiness...they are 2 different things.

The monitors will never set when the rear 02's are off

If you turn them on you may or may not get cat efficiency dtc's

Quote from: SHOdded on May 27, 2016, 07:53:44 PM
I think you would be able to pass emissions with catted downpipes as long as a) you are on the stock tune, b) the rear O2s are turned on, and c) the drive cycle is complete.

I think the catch is that you can't pass if the CEL is on or if the rear O2's are turned off.  The other catted downpipes will likely trigger the CEL without the rear O2's off.

PPE catted downpipes are the only ones listed as 50 state legal meaning they do not trigger the CEL.

I called Stainless Works because I have used their products before.  They said that their catted downpipe for the late model SHO application will trigger the CEL.

Quote from: AJP turbo on May 27, 2016, 08:30:05 PM

If you turn them on you may or may not get cat efficiency dtc's

That's a good point.  Not a guarantee with any aftermarket cats.  Guess, for that matter, it's not a guarantee with stock ones either.  At least those are Ford's problems during the emissions warranty period.

I don't even have emissions testing where I live.  I'm more concerned about warranty at the dealership.  The Magnuson Moss act at least protects you if the aftermarket part is deemed a replacement.  A 50 states cat goes a long way towards showing that it's an aftermarket replacement.  Still no guarantee there either though.

50 state legal doesnt have anything to do with cel...it has to do with the carb certification....every oem has a different strategy for measuring cat efficiency

Quote from: AJP turbo on May 27, 2016, 08:44:20 PM
50 state legal doesnt have anything to do with cel...it has to do with the carb certification....every oem has a different strategy for measuring cat efficiency

Agreed.  My point was that, to be 50 states legal, they have to meet certain standards.  This in turn means they are more likely to meet the needs of the factory cat efficiency tolerances.

I have used race cats on other cars and they do clean up the exhaust some, but they fall way, way short of factory cats.

A catted pipe that still throws a cel is flat out retarded and should be yanked from the shelf

The ecu injects fuel into the engine at times of test...the amount of fuel required for the rear 02's to see a change is measured...the more fuel it takes then the more efficient the cats are and will help the monitors ready

If it only takes a small amount of fuel to show a change in air fuel ratio then the cats are shot and not efficient...thats why you get cat efficiency codes with test pipes and high flow cats

Its called the integrated air fuel method for testing cat efficiency....its in the obd theory in the ford epa manual

Quote from: AJP turbo on May 27, 2016, 08:49:13 PM
A catted pipe that still throws a cel is flat out retarded and should be yanked from the shelf

The ecu injects fuel into the engine at times of test...the amount of fuel required for the rear 02's to see a change is measured...the more fuel it takes then the more efficient the cats are and will help the monitors ready

If it only takes a small amount of fuel to show a change in air fuel ratio then the cats are shot and not efficient...thats why you get cat efficiency codes with test pipes and high flow cats

Its called the integrated air fuel method for testing cat efficiency....its in the obd theory in the ford epa manual

Thanks for this!  I did not know that the ecu deliberately injects fuel to run tests on the cats.  I thought it was just a measurement taken during normal operation.

Is there a downpipe available for our cars besides the PPE that doesn't violate your top statement?  Curious because I'm in the shopping stages.

Here's the OBD manual,it will give you some insight on catalyst efficiency and I/M readiness.  Z        http://www.fordservicecontent.com/ford_content/catalog/motorcraft/OBDSM1505.pdf

Flow & efficiency are not necessarily lock-stepped.  There is the little question of design & materials, sometimes simply the level of quality control.

Crazy, I never would have thought they would throw CEL with the catted DPs.   Basically rules me out from buying DPs in Nazi Illinois.  How does BPD pass, maybe he is south enough to not need to do emissions checks.

Quote from: sholxgt on May 27, 2016, 08:54:09 PM

Quote from: AJP turbo on May 27, 2016, 08:49:13 PM
A catted pipe that still throws a cel is flat out retarded and should be yanked from the shelf

The ecu injects fuel into the engine at times of test...the amount of fuel required for the rear 02's to see a change is measured...the more fuel it takes then the more efficient the cats are and will help the monitors ready

If it only takes a small amount of fuel to show a change in air fuel ratio then the cats are shot and not efficient...thats why you get cat efficiency codes with test pipes and high flow cats

Its called the integrated air fuel method for testing cat efficiency....its in the obd theory in the ford epa manual

Thanks for this!  I did not know that the ecu deliberately injects fuel to run tests on the cats.  I thought it was just a measurement taken during normal operation.

Is there a downpipe available for our cars besides the PPE that doesn't violate your top statement?  Curious because I'm in the shopping stages.

If you are monitoring you can actually see it running the test when cruising, lambda will swing from rich to lean for about 10 seconds then it returns to stoich.

Quote from: Blackhawk on May 28, 2016, 01:30:26 AM
Crazy, I never would have thought they would throw CEL with the catted DPs.   Basically rules me out from buying DPs in Nazi Illinois.  How does BPD pass, maybe he is south enough to not need to do emissions checks.

You can do the catted PPE DPs no CELs and no codes will be set .. I have tested them and no codes set in over 2 years stock or with LMS tune.  You'll enjoy a stronger pull at lower rpms with them... Fun!