PPE Catless Downpipes: Smoking Exhaust

[SHOdded]

I think the more important question here would be, is the core issue an important one?  Could it be left alone to the cats to deal with without any longterm damage?  Still thinking PCV blowby (or piston ring blowby, though seems unlikely) could be the alternate culprit.  If the PCV valve/system is the culprit, then maybe the newest TSB addressing this could be applied.

Do you know the production date for your SHO?

[SRT82ECOBOOST]

It's not a PPE downpipe issue if you want to blame catless pipes in your head fine but blaming PPE vs LMS vs SW downpipes is ridiculous.
Is your position that PPE downpipes cause your issue and if you went LMS catless pipes you would be fine or SW?
Do you see what I'm saying, you're blasting a brand specifically and it's not a brand issue period.

Start reading here:
https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&rlz=1C1FDUM_enUS479US479&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=catless%20downpipes%20cause%20smoking%20site%3Amazdaspeedforums.org

You'll see that the default response is NO the catless downpipes don't cause they issue they expose it.
This is the response from those who know how turbos work over and over again.
Your statement would mean that EVERY race car with turbos and a short downpipe (think 18-30" of actual downpipe open to the ground) would cause turbo failures, that's not the case.

The base of my thought process is not to establish if this loss of backpressure impacts every turbo seal out in the world, but more specifically if they impact the stock turbo seals on an Ecoboost engine, more specifically a 2013 SH0 that I call mine. I am not alone with this happening, here is another one:
http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,2289.0.html
I only have experience with the PPE catless downpipes and therefore any conclusion that I draw on can only be attributed to PPE. It may be applicable to other brands, but the only two places where people mention smoke issues that I found on this forum both also have PPE catless downpipes. So I am not completely unfounded in my assumptions.

[SHOdded]

I think this one is a much worse case, but it is also here to peruse:  http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,500.0.html

[91hybrid]

I agree that brand doesn't really matter in this discussion. It really matter of catted vs. Non-catted. When one has cats installed, its like looking through ray Charles's glasses..... Everything is hidden.

So to make a split as to if the issue is catless dp or the input to the catless dp, you had the dp's on both sides right?  Only one was smoking right? If yes to both statements, then the input to the down pipe is the issue and then you have to problem solve that.

Looking at the input to the dp,  make a split, is it localized oil leaking or excessive oil leaking due to blow by in the engine?  Since you don't see smoke coming out of the drivers side as well, it can't be blow by sucked through the pcv system through the intake. It could be a localized piston on the back bank, but I think that would create a lot if blow by that would be ingested by the intake and the other banks would burn the oil.

So my problem solving of the facts as I know it has lead me to think that your issue is after the engine and before the inlet of the down pipe. What's between there?

Put the dp's back on and take it to the dealer. Show them the smoke and then let them problem solve from there.

John

[SRT82ECOBOOST]

I don't think I want to roll the dice with showing up to the dealership with the downpipes on. That would probably push the envelope on any warranty claim. They should be able to remove the stock downpipe to see any leaks through the turbo seals if that is the culprit.

[91hybrid]

Would they?  If its only localized leaking at this point and its burning as soon as it hits the exhaust stream, would you really see a wet spot?

I thought you said you had a good relationship with your dealer.

[SHOnUup]

I was set on getting catted dpipes until reading this...maybe cat less would be better in a sense of seeing turbo issues sooner? Hmmm

[SRT82ECOBOOST]

Would they?  If its only localized leaking at this point and its burning as soon as it hits the exhaust stream, would you really see a wet spot?

I thought you said you had a good relationship with your dealer.

So far my dealership has not said anything about the mods I have left on the car when I have work done there. But I always remove the tune and 3 bar map sensor before I bring it in there. No need to push the limit of what they will support if I do not have to.

[SRT82ECOBOOST]

I was set on getting catted dpipes until reading this...maybe cat less would be better in a sense of seeing turbo issues sooner? Hmmm

I will have a pair of catless for sale very shortly.

[SHOnUup]

Livernois is only 45 min from me so I'm gonna get majority of stuff done through them...good luck on the fix, hope it's nothing the dealer won't fix.

[Josephm]

How long was the one turbo smoking for? From what I have read, you took the down pipe off immediately once they start smoking.

Oil level maintained at the same position?

How many miles do you have?

What oil are you using?

[SRT82ECOBOOST]

How long was the one turbo smoking for? From what I have read, you took the down pipe off immediately once they start smoking.

Oil level maintained at the same position?

How many miles do you have?

What oil are you using?

Catless downpipes came off after the second day of them smoking. Tough to tell comparison wise on the oil but it was not passed the need to fill line. I have roughly 19,000 miles. Not sure what oil was used.

[68_GT]

I think this serves as a good FYI that in the event you have an unknown mechanical problem if / when you add catless downpipes those issues could be revealed in the form of smoke out the tailpipes. I'd be more concerned about what really is causing the smoke that previoulsy went unoticed while the stock cats were in and burned up the oil.

can the turbo seals not just simply be replaced ?

good info for me I have contimplated getting catless downpipes. With this info it appears it would be good advise to somehow check my turbo seal health first. That should be the discussion. I doubt any brand catless DP caused this issue to begin especially if the issue goes away when the stockers are put back on. If the smoke continued when the stockers were put back on and it didn't smoke prior to the DP installation I guess I would wonder if the new lack of backpressure finidshed off a failing seal, or caused it to fail all together.

[TooFast4SHO]

Even if you have your stock pipes back on with no visable smoke I would not be satisified that back pressure creates a better seal and there are no issues story, I would be getting my car fixed.

Stock down pipes with a free flowing cat back could reduce the back pressure enough to cause issues if that were the case but noone is blaming that reduction in back pressure causing it because it still has cats burning off the oil.

I do agree that "if" you feel you should be talking about this as a "possible" catless downpipe issue, do it reguardless of who bends the pipe...! PPE, Livernois ETC...

I could also see that seals need to condition to thier task and if the task changes it would take time to recondition and reseal as intended. Most people may see the smoke and do the same thing as you, call out the manufaturer, scour the internet to uphold your view point etc. maybe some of the others that see it reducing over time had given the seals enough time to adapt or fixed the cause of the issue.

Either way I hope you get this resolved to your satisfaction and peace of mind.

[EcoPowerParts]

Turbos can be rebuilt, I have people who can do it but I don't have any cores so I can swap them for people.