Is the 3 bar worth the money?
How much psi is gained from it on a lms tuner with out a custom tune
Since im asking questions how much boost does the explorer hit on 2 bar? with the tuner?
I have 26,000 miles would you guys change the plugs if your not having any problems?
On my suby how we rated boost was 1 psi was close to 10 hp so if i added 3 pounds of boost it would add about 30 hp +- couple hp does anyone know if thats case with the 3.5L?
The 2BAR MAP tuner cannot sense (or communicate to the ECU) any boost above 14.5 psi. The 3BAR can up to about 20-23psi. The tune must contain a mod for the 3BAR... All major tuners can add this. There are occasions and sometime spikes of boost up to 16-17psi with stock turbos. Also custom tunes may command higher boost levels than stock tuning. So there is an advantage. Most of the time it merely allows smoother performance due to more incremental readings.I bought one...personal choice
Not trying to jack this thread as I think this will help the OP and myself at the same time.
Where is the cheapest place to reliably pick up a 3 bar sensors these days?
Quote from: SRT82ECOBOOST on April 09, 2014, 08:23:07 AM
Not trying to jack this thread as I think this will help the OP and myself at the same time.
Where is the cheapest place to reliably pick up a 3 bar sensors these days?
Rock Auto
^^^Do you have a link available for Rock Auto?
Quote from: BiGMaC on April 09, 2014, 03:14:50 AM
The 2BAR MAP tuner cannot sense (or communicate to the ECU) any boost above 14.5 psi. The 3BAR can up to about 20-23psi. The tune must contain a mod for the 3BAR... All major tuners can add this. There are occasions and sometime spikes of boost up to 16-17psi with stock turbos. Also custom tunes may command higher boost levels than stock tuning. So there is an advantage. Most of the time it merely allows smoother performance due to more incremental readings.I bought one...personal choice
So you installed yours untuned?
Quote from: SRT82ECOBOOST on April 09, 2014, 08:23:07 AM
Not trying to jack this thread as I think this will help the OP and myself at the same time.
Where is the cheapest place to reliably pick up a 3 bar sensors these days?
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/catalog.php (http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/catalog.php) Then search CX2231
http://parts.autonationfordwhitebearlake.com/parts/index.cfm?searchText=cx2231&make=Ford&action=oePartSearch&siteid=214771 (http://parts.autonationfordwhitebearlake.com/parts/index.cfm?searchText=cx2231&make=Ford&action=oePartSearch&siteid=214771)
I would be willing to try this as it is cheap and easy to have LMS reprogram it but I am struggling a little bit with the fact that my tune never makes over 12 -13 PSI...I don't get spikes above 14 or 15. Maybe they allow for boost to get that high with the 3 bar in the tune? That said previously I thought the only way to run that much boost safely was with Meth...maybe that's changed.
I also have to say I'm not quite following the logic on it allowing "more granularity". Sensors on cars operate on voltages 0-5 or 0-12 etc...that get mapped to values that represent something. i.e. 5 volts is 14.7 psi. If you install a 3 bar map the computer still only knows 0-5 volts but now that needs to represent -14.7 to +29 PSI or so in a 3 bar map. You've actually got LESS granularity for every voltage level...there might be something else it is doing with the ECU or the tables I suppose.
Has anyone tested a 3 Bar at the track (without Meth) and seen any gains?
What confuses me is that 1 bar = 14.7 PSI so why is a 2 bar sensor an issue?
I believe the two bar is measuring both boost and vacuum...so -14.7 to +14.7 PSI...If you want to go above 14.7 you need to get a 3 bar.
Quote from: ecoboostsho on April 09, 2014, 09:24:36 AM
I believe the two bar is measuring both boost and vacuum...so -14.7 to +14.7 PSI...If you want to go above 14.7 you need to get a 3 bar.
Ah...makes perfect sense.
Thanks!
Quote from: FoMoCoSHO on April 09, 2014, 09:28:05 AM
Quote from: ecoboostsho on April 09, 2014, 09:24:36 AM
I believe the two bar is measuring both boost and vacuum...so -14.7 to +14.7 PSI...If you want to go above 14.7 you need to get a 3 bar.
Ah...makes perfect sense.
Thanks!
Not entirely correct. When on the BAR scale, the atmospheric pressure (just regular ole air that we breathe when we step outside is 1 BAR (14.5 psi)), Therefore our 2-BAR sensor measures 1 BAR of boost over atmospheric pressure (14.5 psi of Boost) so by going to the 3 BAR the sensor can measure 2 BAR over atmospheric (29 psi of boost)
Quote from: Fa-SHO on April 09, 2014, 10:23:38 AM
Quote from: FoMoCoSHO on April 09, 2014, 09:28:05 AM
Quote from: ecoboostsho on April 09, 2014, 09:24:36 AM
I believe the two bar is measuring both boost and vacuum...so -14.7 to +14.7 PSI...If you want to go above 14.7 you need to get a 3 bar.
Ah...makes perfect sense.
Thanks!
Not entirely correct. When on the BAR scale, the atmospheric pressure (just regular ole air that we breathe when we step outside is 1 BAR (14.5 psi)), Therefore our 2-BAR sensor measures 1 BAR of boost over atmospheric pressure (14.5 psi of Boost) so by going to the 3 BAR the sensor can measure 2 BAR over atmospheric (29 psi of boost)
Very good info ....
Now I want a 4bar Map ... and someone to make ALL the other big pony parts ..... trany , ptu , and the list goes on .
Hmmmm. Never thought about it from that perspective. Good clarification.
spark plugs should i replace them? starting to learn a lot about the ecoboost in this forum thanks to you all
Quote from: explorergotoluvit on April 10, 2014, 12:28:09 AM
spark plugs should i replace them? starting to learn a lot about the ecoboost in this forum thanks to you all
Since you have a 13 it should have Motorcraft SP534 installed , at the very least check the gap and set them at .030 or you could use NGK iridium or Denso plugs . I use the NGK .
Quote from: SwampRat on April 10, 2014, 02:12:01 AM
Quote from: explorergotoluvit on April 10, 2014, 12:28:09 AM
spark plugs should i replace them? starting to learn a lot about the ecoboost in this forum thanks to you all
Since you have a 13 it should have Motorcraft SP534 installed , at the very least check the gap and set them at .030 or you could use NGK iridium or Denso plugs . I use the NGK .
I have an early model 2013. The updated plugs and .030 gap was not in mine. Must do thing. ;)
I have a 2013 pp the manuel says mcsp528,i guess they were revised to sp534 which is the same part#,i purchased both for comparison.
Just for clarification the sp534 motorcraft plug is made by NGK. 3.99 versus 12.99 :0
Quote from: Needmoreboost on April 10, 2014, 09:38:23 AM
Just for clarification the sp534 motorcraft plug is made by NGK. 3.99 versus 12.99 :0
Made by NGK .. but not the same plug . I paid around $8.00 each with shipping .
Quote from: explorergotoluvit on April 10, 2014, 12:28:09 AM
spark plugs should i replace them? starting to learn a lot about the ecoboost in this forum thanks to you all
Finally a topic I can chime in on; since I'm new to the whole forced induction thing too. But plugs is a universal performance-engine issue.
For those who stay stock, replacing the plugs to "upgrade" is not necessary until the maintenance schedule dictates it. However, in performance engines it's a must.
I see your an LMS guy, but I'm not sure which tune you're running. Might want to add that to your sig line.
If you're running a tune that requires you to use a higher octane fuel you should step down to a colder plug. But good news...there's a reason!
When fuel is refined further it becomes more concentrated and potent as it becomes more potent the octane rating goes up (just like booze) and with that also comes a raise in flash point, meaning it takes more heat to ignite the fuel. The reason you want a higher flash point is: as you increase the performance of your engine, by cramming more air and fuel into your cylinders, you're increasing the compression. As the gas mixture is compressed it gets hot, more compression means higher temps. If the plug itself is hot enough, this aids in raising the temp in the cylinder which is now acting as a glow plug, and the gas mixture detonates before the actual spark is delivered. This pre-detonation is known as spark-knock, and is a BAD THING.
What makes a plug actually hotter or colder? The amount of ceramic around the center electrode. The ceramic acts as a heat sink, so the more ceramic, the colder the plug, the less ceramic the hotter the plug and the more deposits it burns off.
As far as
upgrades go: Due to marketing, there are a lot of misnomers out there about what a plug upgrade gets you, and why. The application of high value metals used in plugs such as platinum, gold, silver, and noble metals such as iridium, magnesium, etc. were adopted for their high melting point and heat resistance, and has nothing to do with conductivity. Their ability to withstand high temps means they can make the center electrode much smaller and with sharper edges. By being smaller, they collect less deposits.
Firestone actually tried marketing polonium tipped plugs at one point under the questionable theory that the radioactivity would ionize the air within the gap, enhancing spark formation. (http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/laughing/rofl.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/) Yay capitalism!
Decreasing the gap is also important. I've a heard a good rule of thumb (for v8's anyway) is to decrease the gap 0.004" per 50hp added when increasing performance. Seems like most guys are running 0.030" in the 3.5L TT EB.
Hi All
when I look up the map for a 2011 F150 with the ecoboost engine I get Motorcraft #CX2401 at rock auto
Isn't the F150 w/ECO boost engine map sensor the 3 bar sensor?
Looking for the correct part number for the 3 bar map sensor
So which is it?
Quote from: mjlkwolfe@gmail.com on April 26, 2014, 10:37:40 AM
Hi All
when I look up the map for a 2011 F150 with the ecoboost engine I get Motorcraft #CX2401 at rock auto
Isn't the F150 w/ECO boost engine map sensor the 3 bar sensor?
Looking for the correct part number for the 3 bar map sensor
So which is it?
Not sure what vehicle you want it for.... here's a link that may help:
http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php?topic=2521.msg38758#msg38758 (http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php?topic=2521.msg38758#msg38758)
Folks ordering from RockAuto are getting the OEM 3BAR MAP
Cx2231 appears to be the 3 bar sensor, the cx2401 is too cheap. I was looking up F150 EB map sensors. I would talk to LMS or Unleashed To confirm though.