Meth FAQ?

[jbeez]

Is there such a thing around here?  I'm just starting to research, it's a little confusing, I'm finding some horror stories on some brands, and other threads with people who have ran that brand forever. Maybe some of the very experienced meth folks could get together and have a round table discussion and come up with a FAQ?

I can rattle off a few of my questions here as I'm researching it, thing that I'm thinking about and questioning. I have a '14 PP SHO, so all of my questions are pretty much specific to that, I don't know if there are considerations with other vehicles or trims(non-PP?).

Is there anything to know about types of fittings or hoses used in the different kits?

Is there a problem or consideration with mounting tank and/or pump in the trunk? I was thinking of maybe doing a larger tank in the trunk but I haven't made that decision yet, leading to the next question.

How much meth do you really use? I mean I can see this being very variable. I don't track my car, but I'd sure like some reductions in IAT. And when I want to smash someone in a, as the police like to call it, exhibition of speed... I want it to get up and gooooooooo!

Costs? What does pure meth cost? I think its flammable, is there anything to know about shipping that? I probably want to run a 49/51 mix though right?  What are the pros and cons of the different mixtures. I only plan to run 93 octane pump gas in my car so I don't know if that plays into this decision process here.

Since these turbos are small and spool so fast, is a progressive kit still worth it or just have it come on at wot?

Vacuum or map splice in preferable?

Are there any other mods to consider before doing a meth injection setup? I saw a noise maker eliminator pipe on ecopowerparts. Can get it with a meth bung in it, but two different sizes, which is most common? Can you plug that bung with something if the kit isn't installed yet?

Safety? What if it runs out? What kind of options do you have to make it as foolproof as possible?

There's probably a few other questions I've had over the past few days that I've forgotten.

[ZSHO]

I would say it all depends if your SHO is your DD or not!!  I used roughly over a quart of VP-M1 100% Methanol during my 3 runs the other day.
There are some speed shops up in PA which stock Methanol on a daily basis avoiding the ridiculous high cost of Hazmet fees.
Feel Free as always to PM Me with any concerns you may have.  Z

[bamsho]

Where are you at in PA?  A&A auto parts is now a VP dealer and is able to get M1 Methanol.  As for usage, that all depends on your right foot.  I put my Alky Controls system on this pas Feb, and just finished my first 5 gallons of M1.  That also includes 4 or 5 track days too. 

As for methanol tank in the car, that is personal choice.  BPD, Z and myself have turned the washer tank into the methanol tank, and have had  put a smaller secondary tank in for the washer fluid.  Now we all use the Alky controls meth kit, and in saying that, all 3 of us have different setups. 

BPD has a dual nozzle setup, Z has the new direct port injection setup, and I have the spray nozzle right before the throttle body with there 15# spray head.  BPD I think is two 10# or 12# nozzles and you will have to ask Z about his.  That setup is fairly new.

I can't comment on the snow system, they will have to chime in here.

Hope this helps.

[TopherSho]

Now that my SNOW kit is working and i see the behavior of how it works for my setup,  my feedback is this :

If you are looking for instant 'Go',   Meth is not what you are looking for.  it requires some special tuning, and until the temps come down your spark/ignition timing tables are going to prevent full power from being developed. 

If you are sitting in your local dragstrip in line for 20 minutes and can see on your handheld tuner that your IAT2 temps are 160+ .. Meth will help you.  but remember it is not instant. it has to cool the IAT2 sensor and the pipe and air charge post spray and that takes a few seconds, in those seconds your launching with reduced power and that initial power loss can be 1,2 3 tenths on the back end.

And like the delay in cooling, until the pump activates you wont have the boost of octane either... so thee is that delay in octane onset to work around as well.

My interpretation of your wants are ''kick butt'' the second you put your foot in it and have it reliable. For that, i strongly recommend against spray and instead recommend e30/e40 blend with a AJP moderately aggressive tune. 

you do not live in Oregon like me so you can pump your own so this is dead simple for you.  Pump 2 gallons of quality e85 in with 5.5 gallons of 93 and have your tuner crank up the timing regardless of heat.  it is instant,  it is consistent,  and doesn't suffer from pump failure or refills at the track.  AJP has a few cars here that run north of e30 blends with astounding power and success.   and none of it requires special tools or installs.   A e30/e40 tune will fit your needs without all the extra work and be instant on every time.

no spray = less moving parts to fail,  less to maintain and monitor more power on demand. 

Now, that being said, spray is still good and has uses.  but now that i have it,  for my opinion it is a track day tool more than a every day ''school the charger R/T at the stop light crowd'' tool.

http://www.wallaceracing.com/ethanol-mix-calc.php

My 2 octanes of advise ... cheers!

[jbeez]

I may never be on a drag strip, the streets are tough enough! I was at a light the other day and next to me was a BMW X6 M.... crossover lookin thing. Needless to say he stuck it to me pretty bad, 575hp tt v8. My foot was pressing the gas pedal through the floor and I felt like I wasn't moving. I also had the AC on and it was about 90deg out. I wasn't expecting a race and he got the jump on me. I will occasionally have some spirited driving like that. So I'm thinking next thing I need to do is maybe a 160 or 170 tstat, since i have about 46k miles on the car its about time to change my radiator fluid anyway might as well get a tstat replaced. PTU probably needs to be changed, never did that. Just did spark plugs.  I prob have some crap on the back of the valves, not really sure what to do about that to be honest. After the tstat and ptu change, meth kit, and downpipes are on the list. my factory flex coupler is frayed so I need to fix that anyway, some ppe catted downpipes should do the trick. Just need a few bucks, been bleeding money into my house the last few months!

[TopherSho]

I may never be on a drag strip, the streets are tough enough! I was at a light the other day and next to me was a BMW X6 M.... crossover lookin thing. Needless to say he stuck it to me pretty bad, 575hp tt v8. My foot was pressing the gas pedal through the floor and I felt like I wasn't moving. I also had the AC on and it was about 90deg out. I wasn't expecting a race and he got the jump on me. I will occasionally have some spirited driving like that. So I'm thinking next thing I need to do is maybe a 160 or 170 tstat, since i have about 46k miles on the car its about time to change my radiator fluid anyway might as well get a tstat replaced. PTU probably needs to be changed, never did that. Just did spark plugs.  I prob have some crap on the back of the valves, not really sure what to do about that to be honest. After the tstat and ptu change, meth kit, and downpipes are on the list. my factory flex coupler is frayed so I need to fix that anyway, some ppe catted downpipes should do the trick. Just need a few bucks, been bleeding money into my house the last few months!

Understood! 

In terms of costs.. Pipes and a e30/e40 tune will ABSOLUTELY be the best bang for buck.  Hell you can skip the 3-bar initially as well.  With the e30/e40 tune you will gain a crap load of spark which is all torque and launch speed,  and with the down-pipes you will spool sooner and longer.

if your on a budget my 2c is go there 1st ..  

Shake off the BMW loss.  Only a select few forum members here could catch that beast..  in oem form that beemer throws 12.1 1/4 miles

[jbeez]

My sig isn't upto date, but i have a 3bar and torrie 93octane

[TopherSho]

Gotcha!

[ZSHO]

I would try going with your Tuner's recommendations so your able to coincide in the best method/approach to take but of course its not mandatory- IMO. Z

[jbeez]

Well he did say he can tune any meth kit I put on there, I was asking him if it mattered the other day.

[jbeez]

I may never be on a drag strip, the streets are tough enough! I was at a light the other day and next to me was a BMW X6 M.... crossover lookin thing. Needless to say he stuck it to me pretty bad, 575hp tt v8. My foot was pressing the gas pedal through the floor and I felt like I wasn't moving. I also had the AC on and it was about 90deg out. I wasn't expecting a race and he got the jump on me. I will occasionally have some spirited driving like that. So I'm thinking next thing I need to do is maybe a 160 or 170 tstat, since i have about 46k miles on the car its about time to change my radiator fluid anyway might as well get a tstat replaced. PTU probably needs to be changed, never did that. Just did spark plugs.  I prob have some crap on the back of the valves, not really sure what to do about that to be honest. After the tstat and ptu change, meth kit, and downpipes are on the list. my factory flex coupler is frayed so I need to fix that anyway, some ppe catted downpipes should do the trick. Just need a few bucks, been bleeding money into my house the last few months!

Understood! 

In terms of costs.. Pipes and a e30/e40 tune will ABSOLUTELY be the best bang for buck.  Hell you can skip the 3-bar initially as well.  With the e30/e40 tune you will gain a crap load of spark which is all torque and launch speed,  and with the down-pipes you will spool sooner and longer.

if your on a budget my 2c is go there 1st ..  

Shake off the BMW loss.  Only a select few forum members here could catch that beast..  in oem form that beemer throws 12.1 1/4 miles

when you say pipes, you mean downpipes, not the intake pipe kit right? What do you mean by e30/e40, the 30/70 or 40/60 meth spray? or are you talking about gasoline/ethanol blend? I don't think I have any ethanol stations near me.

[jbeez]

Where are you at in PA?  A&A auto parts is now a VP dealer and is able to get M1 Methanol.  As for usage, that all depends on your right foot.  I put my Alky Controls system on this pas Feb, and just finished my first 5 gallons of M1.  That also includes 4 or 5 track days too. 

As for methanol tank in the car, that is personal choice.  BPD, Z and myself have turned the washer tank into the methanol tank, and have had  put a smaller secondary tank in for the washer fluid.  Now we all use the Alky controls meth kit, and in saying that, all 3 of us have different setups. 

BPD has a dual nozzle setup, Z has the new direct port injection setup, and I have the spray nozzle right before the throttle body with there 15# spray head.  BPD I think is two 10# or 12# nozzles and you will have to ask Z about his.  That setup is fairly new.

I can't comment on the snow system, they will have to chime in here.

Hope this helps.

I'm pretty close to Trenton NJ(but I avoid going into NJ as much as possible). Just north of Philly

[bpd1151]

Although I am sure Topher means well.....

I wouldn't necessarily agree with his "strongly recommend against spray (meth)" comment based on his experiences alone.

I happen to prefer meth over any E blending for a myriad of reasons and I don't care to continue beating a dead horse on the issue.

So alas I digress.....

That said, I don't keep my car running in the staging lanes so I have no issues with heat or IAT's creeping up as claimed.

I also don't concern myself about "more moving parts" as in eluding to a pump failure. Pumps do have a duty cycle, yes. But their average life span is 2.5-3yrs. $80 to rebuild a meth pump is peanuts for the amount of play time one gains from their use.

Meth will give you instant on results depending on your set up. For me? I am running two 15# nozzles on a dual setup. I am running Alky Controls. Which has a progressive controller. I have read posts here, as well as elsewhere, whereas Snow Performance has had some customer support issues, as well as product issues. Me personally, I wouldn't go the Snow route. There are differences in product, support there of, as well as individual experiences.

My setup is custom dyno tuned, so I have the comfort of a "set it and forget it" mentality.

Whether at the track, or on the streets schooling a Porsche, Vette, Pony, or any other would be player, I get instant and consistent power results each and every damn time.

No digs on anyone, just my own experiences are that meth is the way to go. Keep in mind, OEM LPFP pumps hae been shown to fail to, and using an E blend of varying concoction(s) will tax the LPFP more than just using unleaded blends as it was designed to be used.

Ummm, what else? Oh yea, usage/costs/etc. is completely contingent on one's use of the skinny pedal.

Nice thing about employing a progressive control system like Alky Controls uses, is that the cone(s) are metered. Surpass the area where it is set (for me, pump starts priming at 7-7.5lbs of boost) gently, whereas pump begins spraying at 8lbs, that cone (of meth) is metered/small. Lay into it like a WOT run at a track, or any given red light on the street, that cone is full open.

So being congnizant of your settings as it relates to where it comes on/sprays, will help you maintain your usage.

Good luck in whichever path you choose. Plenty have shown that either road you head down, will be of benefit.

To that end, more meth cars hold more records, as well as the fastest record, over E users. At least thus far since 2014 that is.

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[jbeez]

I'm not considering ethanol in tank at all, only meth injection and standard fuel mixture which is either winter or summer blends in south eastern PA, I typically stick to only exxon or shell 93, I will occasionally use sunoco or another if i can't find a top tier station and I need to fill up on the road.

The closest E85 station is about a half hour drive from me, not really interested in spending an hour to go get gas, and using a nice chunk of it in the process

[bpd1151]

Talk directly with Brian Michael (a.k.a. BAM_SHO) as he is in your immediate area, and can give you direct hands on input.

I know he posted here previously, but he is a really great, down to earth person to speak with, and he has rep'd the SHO platform for many generations, not just the Gen4/Gen 5 SHO's.

PM if need be, and exchange personal contact info. Nothing beats real live, hands on, tangible interaction. Something that seems to have been lost with the advent of the internet.

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