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LMS Downpipe Install - Throwing DTC Codes!

Started by MileHighV, July 09, 2015, 10:28:51 PM

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MileHighV

Sunday - installed my LMS Catted Downpipes.  What a b*tch to remove the OE downpipes (6 hrs) - new pipes slid right in.
I started it to check for leaks (saw none - no codes).

Monday - Installed the re-gapped spark plugs - got her back on the ground - took her for a short 10 minute run.
No WOT - mostly part throttle - crappy, rainy weather.  No CEL, no codes.

Tuesday - Planned to do T-stat install - No time (agonizing over 160 vs 170) - will have both by this weekend.

Wednesday - No time (work sux).

Thursday (today) - Drove her to work - No CEL (assume no codes) - a few times during part throttle hear a strange vibration.
I swear on very part throttle that I can hear a low turbo whistle/drone - not a particularly pleasant sound.
Drive home from work - A couple of interstate blasts, several errands (stop & restart), and then - bright yellow CEL  :o
Doesn't drive strange - check the codes when I get home:
     P0420 - Catalyst System Efficiency Below Threshold (Bank 1)
     P0430 - Catalyst System Efficiency Below Threshold (Bank 2)
     C1B00 - Steering Angle Sensor - Signal Erratic

I suspect that I have an exhaust leak, but I can't seem to find it.

Question 1:  What is the recommended torque on the exhaust flange nuts from the exhaust pipe to the turbo?
                         I torqued them to 20 lb-ft, re-using the metal gaskets that came with the car.
Question 2:  What is the recommended torque for the O2 sensors?
                         I just snugged them (hard), using sensor safe RTV on the seat surface (not the threads).
Question 3:  What is the recommended torque for the rear bolts at the flex sections to the 3rd cat/resonator?
                         I torqued them to 20 lb-ft, re-using the metal gaskets that came with the car.

Any ideas on what I have done wrong?

Thanks for all the help!

So far, I like the downpipes - less raspy, slightly deeper - seems to spool faster - need more time on the street!
(planning on t-stat, 3 bar MAP, and tune install this weekend, if I can get this part figured out!) -  :-



2013 Sterling Grey SHO w/ Performance Pack
PPE Catted Downpipes, Livernois 93 tune, 3 bar MAP
EvenFlow 160º T-stat, Eibach Rear Springs, 20% tint
355hp @ wheels (444hp @ crank)

ZSHO

#1
The key to the foundation is the tune,and what type of car do you have exactly and the tune will bypass the rear 02 sensors,the C1BOO is a eratic body code and should not worry about it for now and welcome. Z


2013 Performance Package SHO| Livernois Custom Methanol Tune|3-Bar Map|Reische-170-Stat|Full Race Tial-10psi BOV in Black|PPE-Gloss Black Hot Pipes|EPP Dual Intake in Gloss Black|PPE Catted DP|Corsa Sport Cat Back Exhaust|H&R Sport-Springs|CFM Performance Billet Valve Cover Breather In Gloss Black|Llumar 20%Ceramic window Tint|MSD Ignition Coils in Black|Extreme Roof Spoiler|Redline Fluids all around|Gearhead Intercooler|First-SHO With Direct Port Alky-VP-M1-100%-Methanol Injection|LMS-Custom-Dyno-Tuned @ 415whp-465wtq| Best Trap Speed of 115.54 mph|

SHOdded

Welcome to EBPF, sorry to hear your vehicle is having issues! 
You are right, exhaust leak would be a good suspect.  Sometimes you need to install new gaskets, even doubling up on them to make sure the seal is good & tight. 
O2 wires often get nicked in the process, and then the sensor has to be replaced. 
What brand of plugs are you using?  Did you use new plugs or re-gap the old ones?  If old, how many miles on them?
Ford has a TSB for concurrent p0420 and p0430 codes, but if you do choose to recalibrate, return your SHO to stock before having it done.  Then get the new strategy code and have your tuner update the tune accordingly before re-installing on the SHO.
http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,3836.msg79035.html#msg79035
May need wheel hubs replaced due to that C1B00 code.  See more details here: 
http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,3965.msg62365.html#msg62365
2007 Ford Edge SEL, Powerstop F/R Brake Kit, TXT LED 6000K Lo & Hi Beams, W16W LED Reverse Bulbs, 3BSpec 2.5w Map Lights, 5W Cree rear dome lights, 5W Cree cargo light, DTBL LED Taillights

If tuned:  Take note of the strategy code as you return to stock (including 3 bar MAP to 2 bar MAP) -> take car in & get it serviced -> check strategy code when you get car back -> have tuner update your tune if the strategy code has changed -> reload tune -> ENJOY!

MileHighV

#3
2013 SHO PP - LMS Downpipes, spark plugs re-gapped to 0.030" - that's it.

The changes I described above are the first mods done to the car.

I am planning on a t-stat, 3 bar MAP and LMS 91 octane tune (thus the plugs), but have not done these yet.

I thought I would start with the pipes first, but I am having issues as noted above.

All of the LMS stuff came with absolutely no instructions, and even after I asked for some, I got a very generic email, with no torque values, etc.  Another surprise was that I needed new bolts at the rear of the exhaust at the flex sections.  Luckily, O'Reilly was open late on Sunday.

Anyway - enough bitching - Any ideas on what I have done?
Is it just the re-gapped plugs without the tune that is causing my issues? 
I can install the tune and 3 bar MAP easily, and do the t-stat over the weekend.

Thanks!
2013 Sterling Grey SHO w/ Performance Pack
PPE Catted Downpipes, Livernois 93 tune, 3 bar MAP
EvenFlow 160º T-stat, Eibach Rear Springs, 20% tint
355hp @ wheels (444hp @ crank)

MileHighV

Brand new plugs - Motorcraft SP-534 - regapped

2013 Sterling Grey SHO w/ Performance Pack
PPE Catted Downpipes, Livernois 93 tune, 3 bar MAP
EvenFlow 160º T-stat, Eibach Rear Springs, 20% tint
355hp @ wheels (444hp @ crank)

SHOdded

2007 Ford Edge SEL, Powerstop F/R Brake Kit, TXT LED 6000K Lo & Hi Beams, W16W LED Reverse Bulbs, 3BSpec 2.5w Map Lights, 5W Cree rear dome lights, 5W Cree cargo light, DTBL LED Taillights

If tuned:  Take note of the strategy code as you return to stock (including 3 bar MAP to 2 bar MAP) -> take car in & get it serviced -> check strategy code when you get car back -> have tuner update your tune if the strategy code has changed -> reload tune -> ENJOY!

BiGMaC

#6
Maybe I missed it... But are your LMS DPs catted or non-catted.  I would contact LMS or Ford for the manifold fastener torque. I have catted PPE DPs, but my car was used in the development of the PPEs... And was dyno'd multiple times with each set. I have never had a DTC or CEL, even stock tuned, other than the non-catted version on stock tune... The O2 sensor complains.

•2013 Taurus SHO nonPP - All Ford factory options, 3BAR MAP, LMS v8 tune (mods for 3BAR, DPs, and T-stat), Paint & plastic correction, CQuart finest all exterior surfaces, limo black window tint,VLED Triton switchbacks, Daytime BrightLites switchback DRLs, full interior and exterior LED conversion, Lamin-X charcoal blackout tail lights and reflectors, PPE catted and coated downpipes, EBPP coated hotpipes with BoVs VTA, MDesign CAI
•2013 F250 CC Lariat 6.7EB Diesel -stock

MileHighV

#7
Catted - quality built.

Had trouble getting the rear pre-cat O2 sensor out (twisted the wires pretty good), but had absolutely no issues with the front O2 sensors (pre-cat or post cat).  Just unplugged them, and then re-installed.

I would not have been surprised to see a code on one bank only (rear bank), but did not expect both...
2013 Sterling Grey SHO w/ Performance Pack
PPE Catted Downpipes, Livernois 93 tune, 3 bar MAP
EvenFlow 160º T-stat, Eibach Rear Springs, 20% tint
355hp @ wheels (444hp @ crank)

BiGMaC

The MagnaFlow high flow cats?...

Any new raw fuel odors? ... Thinking of things that could kill the cats.

Don't think a leak will throw a code... It does take 45-50 miles to set this code in my '13 SHO.  I haven't heard of problems with the new gen LMS DPs... Making me wonder about the sensors... PPE even uses a special wrench on the O2 sensors.... Check the wiring too.

•2013 Taurus SHO nonPP - All Ford factory options, 3BAR MAP, LMS v8 tune (mods for 3BAR, DPs, and T-stat), Paint & plastic correction, CQuart finest all exterior surfaces, limo black window tint,VLED Triton switchbacks, Daytime BrightLites switchback DRLs, full interior and exterior LED conversion, Lamin-X charcoal blackout tail lights and reflectors, PPE catted and coated downpipes, EBPP coated hotpipes with BoVs VTA, MDesign CAI
•2013 F250 CC Lariat 6.7EB Diesel -stock

MileHighV

Well - the mileage required to set the code makes sense - I probably finally put 40 miles on her today. 

I did not disconnect the battery - maybe unplugging the sensors caused fault?
I unplugged all the others but the rear pre-cat (only 'cause I could not get to that plug).

Maybe I will clear the codes in the morning, and see if they return after going to work & back.

I could also yank the sensors out tonight and sniff for fuel...

Weird with no other changes...
2013 Sterling Grey SHO w/ Performance Pack
PPE Catted Downpipes, Livernois 93 tune, 3 bar MAP
EvenFlow 160º T-stat, Eibach Rear Springs, 20% tint
355hp @ wheels (444hp @ crank)

ZSHO

How many miles on your SHO? when did you purchase the DP,are they new.BTW do have torque pro,cause you can check a little deeper to see whats going on. Z


2013 Performance Package SHO| Livernois Custom Methanol Tune|3-Bar Map|Reische-170-Stat|Full Race Tial-10psi BOV in Black|PPE-Gloss Black Hot Pipes|EPP Dual Intake in Gloss Black|PPE Catted DP|Corsa Sport Cat Back Exhaust|H&R Sport-Springs|CFM Performance Billet Valve Cover Breather In Gloss Black|Llumar 20%Ceramic window Tint|MSD Ignition Coils in Black|Extreme Roof Spoiler|Redline Fluids all around|Gearhead Intercooler|First-SHO With Direct Port Alky-VP-M1-100%-Methanol Injection|LMS-Custom-Dyno-Tuned @ 415whp-465wtq| Best Trap Speed of 115.54 mph|

MileHighV

#11
Bought the car new in June 2013 - has 17,386 miles as of today.
She's my daily driver - less than 15 miles to work and back.

Catted DP's are brand new, just purchased them right before the 4th.
Got excited, and threw them on over last weekend - now a little nervous  :o

I did pull both post cat O2 sensors last night - no fuel smell, nice & dry.
They look just like they did when I pulled them out of the OE DP's.
Reinstalled them with a little more RTV, tighted them down with the O2 socket.
I am definitely not getting them as tight as they were getting them off, but they were not loose.

Gonna clear the codes, drive to work & back, and see if it throws them again.

I do not have Torque Pro - Unfortunately not available for Window Phones.
I uploaded OBD Auto Doctor app, which seems to be similar (though not as highly rated) :(
Ordered the BAFX Bluetooth Diagnostic scan tool, and will see what I can find out this weekend.

Thanks to everyone for your help - I hope that this is resolved soon, so I can get to the tune!


2013 Sterling Grey SHO w/ Performance Pack
PPE Catted Downpipes, Livernois 93 tune, 3 bar MAP
EvenFlow 160º T-stat, Eibach Rear Springs, 20% tint
355hp @ wheels (444hp @ crank)

ZSHO

#12
I was curious if you noticed any changes like a rough idle,hesitation of any kind,personaly would start it up in the morning and let her warm up real good and see if you notice any kind of water,condensation on the floor post cat,if so it could be a leak like SHOdded mentioned and new gaskets are in order,BTW the 02 sensors are very fragile and the tips must be handled with extra caution,also did Livernois send you a V8.DP.3-BAR TUNE already. Z


2013 Performance Package SHO| Livernois Custom Methanol Tune|3-Bar Map|Reische-170-Stat|Full Race Tial-10psi BOV in Black|PPE-Gloss Black Hot Pipes|EPP Dual Intake in Gloss Black|PPE Catted DP|Corsa Sport Cat Back Exhaust|H&R Sport-Springs|CFM Performance Billet Valve Cover Breather In Gloss Black|Llumar 20%Ceramic window Tint|MSD Ignition Coils in Black|Extreme Roof Spoiler|Redline Fluids all around|Gearhead Intercooler|First-SHO With Direct Port Alky-VP-M1-100%-Methanol Injection|LMS-Custom-Dyno-Tuned @ 415whp-465wtq| Best Trap Speed of 115.54 mph|

MileHighV

No rough idle at all - seems perfectly normal.
No hesitation, although on a few acceleration runs yesterday I heard/felt a strange vibration - I thought that the DP's might be hitting the dogbone transmission mount.  When I crawled under last night, I see no evidence of hitting/rubbing on the dogbone - not sure what that was.

Is it possible that the 0.030" plug gap without running the tune is an issue?

I have the latest tunes (91 & 93) from LMS in the tuner, but have not loaded them into the car.

Nervous now, as I may have to undo all of the DP work just to take her into the dealer - sux, 'cause these are not easy to get to.
Any way to read the O2 sensors directly?

Thanks!
2013 Sterling Grey SHO w/ Performance Pack
PPE Catted Downpipes, Livernois 93 tune, 3 bar MAP
EvenFlow 160º T-stat, Eibach Rear Springs, 20% tint
355hp @ wheels (444hp @ crank)

ZSHO

#14
The plugs should not have an effect,would just monitor for any other codes,quite honestly you spent a good amount of money and would definetly email Livernois directly with your concerns,they are a bunch of very cool guys over there,Anthony is in charge of the tuning. info@livernoismotorsports.com and keep us updated,and make sure you are tuned for the DP and 3-bar,good luck. Z


2013 Performance Package SHO| Livernois Custom Methanol Tune|3-Bar Map|Reische-170-Stat|Full Race Tial-10psi BOV in Black|PPE-Gloss Black Hot Pipes|EPP Dual Intake in Gloss Black|PPE Catted DP|Corsa Sport Cat Back Exhaust|H&R Sport-Springs|CFM Performance Billet Valve Cover Breather In Gloss Black|Llumar 20%Ceramic window Tint|MSD Ignition Coils in Black|Extreme Roof Spoiler|Redline Fluids all around|Gearhead Intercooler|First-SHO With Direct Port Alky-VP-M1-100%-Methanol Injection|LMS-Custom-Dyno-Tuned @ 415whp-465wtq| Best Trap Speed of 115.54 mph|