SwampRat please read

Livernois Motorsports · April 30, 2014, 07:54:18 PM

SwampRat, I wanted to take the time to address some concerns you have. This is an open invitation to you to come to our facility at no cost to you so you can view our data in person. As we have posted many times, we enjoy educating individuals and the community as a whole. I am not sure why anyone in the community would think we have anything to gain by putting out false information to anyone. Our reputation is not worth such trivial things. Please contact us via PM, or email us to set this up. We look forward to the opportunity to show you the reality of our statements.

Please do not take this for anything other than it is, us taking the time to offer to show you that your concerns about our honesty are unwarranted, and also to show you that our concerns about some advice transpiring on the board can be dangerous. Even though you aren't even a supporter of ours we want to show you why we make certain statements, and why we are so concerned that people be educated on these matters.

SwampRat · April 30, 2014, 08:05:55 PM

Will do ...

Livernois Motorsports · April 30, 2014, 08:09:46 PM

sounds good, we will await you contacting us and get you out here and set up in a hotel. Detroit's a great place for a car guy!

bigmoneycloser · April 30, 2014, 08:10:26 PM

I like this move...
It will be very cool to see the review from SW..
PS I wanna come too... Lol

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BBOX · April 30, 2014, 09:02:26 PM

Not that I didn't have respect for LMS before, but for them to step up in this fashion is hella impressive.

panther427 · April 30, 2014, 09:03:27 PM

I have a question. Why do you only tune for water meth with your own kit?

EcoPowerParts · April 30, 2014, 10:06:09 PM

SW asked me to do this via PM but I'll put it out here so he can hopefully get these statements verified:
1. OBD2 items that are logged aren't correct - I'm going to assume meaning via Torque or via SCT (each build out their own formulas)
- Test data log with Torque or SCT livewire repeat test and datalog with LMS items - compare logs. Whatever pids they choose. Video of this happening would be great.
2. High pressure fuel pump readings are off - I'm curious how LMS reviews HPFP if they don't trust the ECU data to do it, new hardlines from injectors to HPFP with a pressure sensor built in it? Again log and compare, video of this would be great.

FoMoCoSHO · April 30, 2014, 10:45:42 PM

I'd like to make a comment about Torque that I have learned firsthand that backs up at least part of what Livernois claims. It is SLOW. I'm not sure whether it's due to code not using the processing power efficiently or whether it doesn't connect to the canbus at the full data rate...

I am now using OBDLink which connects at the max theoretical speed of Ford's canbus and the difference is pretty shocking.

Take two data points in torque and there will be 20 more between those two points using OBDLink. There is a lot of area "under the curve" between Torque data points that is not being logged.

Whether those data points are accurate still remains to be seen.

For all you folks with OBDMX adapters, go to google play, download it, and try it out to see for yourself.

I watched some of 4DR's vids with embedded torque gauges to verify my sanity, LOL. I wanted to make sure it wasn't just my hardware set up.

IHeartGroceries · April 30, 2014, 11:17:05 PM

In regards to just monitoring PIDs, that seems moot. Unless, you're suggesting the sample rate is so small, that it is possible to miss entirely points of data, such as very brief, but dangerously low drops in pressure, say, at WOT?

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FoMoCoSHO · April 30, 2014, 11:19:20 PM

Quote from: IHeartGroceries on April 30, 2014, 11:17:05 PM
In regards to just monitoring PIDs, that seems moot. Unless, you're suggesting the sample rate is so small, that it is possible to miss entirely points of data, such as very brief, but dangerously low drops in pressure, say, at WOT?

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That is exactly what I am suggesting.

FoMoCoSHO · April 30, 2014, 11:21:44 PM

I wouldn't mind tagging along either....

SwampRat · April 30, 2014, 11:25:46 PM

Quote from: FoMoCoSHO on April 30, 2014, 11:21:44 PM
I wouldn't mind tagging along either....

Would be nice for someone to watch my back ... Detroits kinda ruff from what I hear .....

IHeartGroceries · April 30, 2014, 11:50:36 PM

Does the SCT function as a PID scanner, or a data logger? If so, at what rate?
Max speed for Ford CANbus is...500K?
So, I'm assuming some of the limitation in sample rate isn't just in Torque app. It is also with BT OBDII devices, capable of only very low baud rates?

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FoMoCoSHO · April 30, 2014, 11:52:46 PM

Quote from: IHeartGroceries on April 30, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
Does the SCT function as a PID scanner, or a data logger? If so, at what rate?
Max speed for Ford CANbus is...500K?
So, I'm assuming some of the limitation in sample rate isn't just in Torque app. It is also with BT OBDII devices, capable of only very low baud rates?

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Nope, OBDLink with OBDMX connects at 500k, to verify I turned off all other connection options.

IHeartGroceries · May 01, 2014, 12:22:10 AM

But, for example, many of the cheaper options, I'm guessing are a lower rate? I have one (a cheap one). But, I'm so lazy anymore in regards to this type of thing that I really haven't used it, or Torque, or anything else for that matter. 500K ought to open the door for tons of datapoints.
I kept a MSD Dashhawk in my Speed6 for many years, both for live PID monitoring, and data logging. It served me quite well.

May have to check out the OBDMX.

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