im not sure if sct has released anything this whole year that helps me tune this car.it seem like they are way behind in updates.
anyway
for whatever reason
AFR BANK ONE in my car is intermittent.i can drive 20 miles without it ever reading, park the car, come back out 10 min later and its now working and reading= wt f
this is of course after it was working the night before and a brand new flash.
checked for leaks around both d/ps and all 4 sensors- none- all 4 sensors plugged in- none rubbing/bent or twisted under the car.????
bank 2 sensor 1- doesn't read at all-period- but it knows cat temperature OF 700 degrees???
no other pid tables will it read on that sensor at all.
more confusion
short term fuel trim is fine
car wot is set for .80 Target but third gear starts going .90-100 even though ive commanded not to lean out???
any insight would be profound thanks
I would say your car has been tuneable for a while....i think you are reaching at this point in thinking sct is your problem
Based on what you say its hard to even tell for sure if you even have a problem or if there is a mechanical problem you are all over the map.
Could you be mis interpreting the readings?
Any other symptoms?
Programming on these isnt always simple so if your change doesnt give what is expected its quite possible you missed something rather than a lack of functionality
Any other symptoms?no -
intermittent Afr bank 1- cant continue without a solid working one.
- why isn't it working? do these things fail in 4000 miles
has anyone else had this?
bank 2 doesn't read at all - self explanatory -only reads cat temp on cat less down pipes
why?
this isn't tuning- this is why isn't it reading
You should post a log of a good WOT pull with enough items to adequately show the sensors in question...Your posts are way to vague for people to help you.
Just a wild guess on my part but you have a new SHO that would seem unlikely to me that you are having all the issues you think you are having.
Have you begun to spray your meth yet that you spoke of before and have you done much wiring? You were also having problems with your flashing...I'm starting to wonder if they could be related
I agree, revert to stock and evaluate. Then list all the mods you have made (hardware) and evaluate with a canned tune. But if you have a meth kit installed, a canned tune will not work anyway.
okay lets clear the mud:no meth yet- 2 bar stock map.
sct doesn't support 2016 sho cars- thats direct from scts mouth on the second lock up.
if you scan the x4 box for compatibility -there is none.
unless you use 2013-2014 strategy and tune from there(not giving away any tuners secrets)-THERE IS NO 2015-2016 SUPPORT
there is no value files,no dmr list for 2016-
its such fun going back to 2014 to read the descriptions of what your changing-
sct live link has no updates for 2016, no descriptions or dmr period.
yes you can tune the car-but is it giving you what you need to do it right - hardly
back to stock-pay attention here.
tuners and non tuners welcome to reply- im not a dealer/tuner
lams bank 1 and 2 are copies of each other exactly.
does the car not use bank 2 like the f-150?my car has no reading on bank 2 on its own.
cat temps are identical copies on bank 1 and 2.
measured afr only works on bank 1
ltft is 0 on both banks
afr bank 2 is o- it doesn't read
stftr reads identical as bank 1
(unless you tune yourself im not expecting any answers you will not know what im talking about)
There is no problem tuning 2015 or 2016 sho's
Everything is there to tune those
The only thing sct means by no support is that there are no canned tunes that available nor can you buy an x4 with pre-loaded tunes
The customer service rep was ill informed and mis spoke
What version of live link are you using?
Quote from: AJP turbo on December 29, 2016, 09:51:15 PM
There is no problem tuning 2015 or 2016 sho's
Everything is there to tune those
The only thing sct means by no support is that they no canned tunes that available nor can you buy an x4 with pre-loaded tunes
The customer service rep was ill informed and mis spoke
What version of live link are you using?
2015 AJP tuned chiming in. No issues tuning my car, the strategy is supported etc. Like I told you a long long time ago, 13+ does not have canned tune support, you need a good custom tune.
Banks 1 and 2 are not copies of each other on my car, if they were copies, ford would not have spent time/money to put in sensors on bank 2. It seems you may still be having bad flashes/issues flashing a tune, possibly even something going on with your ECU, or issues with hardware install, but not saying any of that is the case, just possibilities from what I have seen.
live link version?-since i just downloaded it last month -hopefully the latest?? ill get back to you ajp
i also have a code 2251 that just showed up- bank or fuel related- im sure
ill post my stock log showing more
Quote
It seems you may still be having bad flashes/issues flashing a tune, possibly even something going on with your ECU, or issues with hardware install, but not saying any of that is the case, just possibilities from what I have seen.
its not reading BANK 2 STOCK
Post whatever log/tune is showing what you are describing.
Open livelink and look in the top left of the screen..It will show the version
That dtc is a wiring problem it seems...So being that you did downpipes it doesn't seem impossible that something happened to the wires and or the sensors.....And it's really starting to seem like you may have electrical gremlins being that you had a lot of difficulty with the flashing and now this
I wouldn't even attempt throwing a tune back on until you can make a good log with the stock tune.
Senor 1 of both banks should display readings and LAMBSE for both banks should display the same
You can believe it or not the choice is your's but I assure you there is complete tune ability for your SHO.
Value files from SCT are only values that SCT puts in their software for tuners to use if they want and quite honestly I don't care to use any of them for the SHO...Some are good some are not.
But even if there are none available the tuner is free to make any changes to the tune they want as long as the strategy is available...And obviously if you have flashed a tune then your strategy is available.
You can not flash another strategy to an ECU that is different...You can copy values from a different strategy and import them to your strategy but that can also cause lockups with the flash...I say that because you mentioned that you were using 2013/14 values...Something to think about maybe
Any updates on this?...logs? Livelink version?
Quote from: SHOurpp on December 29, 2016, 09:34:02 PM
unless you use 2013-2014 strategy and tune from there(not giving away any tuners secrets)-THERE IS NO 2015-2016 SUPPORT
You dont have the same software the dealers have so there aren't really any secrets you can give away.
2017 strategies are added daily as they are requested...the 2015-2016 strategies are becoming old news at this point
im buying a new oxygen sensor for front cylinders per code 2251
bank 2 sensor 1- front of car-wires routed to the cooling fans(i believe thats the right one) correct me if im wrong here please.
if ajp is right and the wires got pinched or pulled on the down pipes ,the stft and ltft will default to the working sensor.
thats why they are copies of each other; it throws code because afr isn't reading right
i looked at the canned tune for 2013 and 14
the only fueling change made by sct was lowering the temp so the engine would go open/closed loop faster.
Quote from: AJP turbo on December 31, 2016, 01:22:34 PM
Quote from: SHOurpp on December 29, 2016, 09:34:02 PM
unless you use 2013-2014 strategy and tune from there(not giving away any tuners secrets)-THERE IS NO 2015-2016 SUPPORT
You dont have the same software the dealers have so there aren't really any secrets you can give away.
2017 strategies are added daily as they are requested...the 2015-2016 strategies are becoming old news at this point
just a shame they haven't added dmr or value files for 2 years
Not much has changed for 2015-2016 ...there are only 2 main families of tunes for the SHO
2010-2012 and 3013+
Everything thing for 2013+ is about the same....doesnt matter if you have 2010-2012 or 2013+ every strategy has small differences
You never listed what version of live link you are running...there are plenty of 2015 ive seen that log dmr's
I think for 2013+ all the direct memory read(DMR) addresses are the same
here is the log - stock reading
Your car is all sorts of jacked up at the moment.
Your DTC is for bank 1 and it's your bank 2 that seems to be the main culprit possibly....Your bank 2 measured afr doesn't read at all. That, I think is causing your car to kick into some mode where it's using bank 1 for fuel corrections which is why your stft's are identical. But even your stft's are not reading all the time which is even more weird.
You say you are commanding .80 at WOT....You have not done any fuel tuning...Your target actually changes from 1.00 down to .71...And it looks to be the stock fuel curve to me...Your desired TIP is all over the place too meaning that your commanded boost is ALL over the place
If you think you are commanding .80 lambda you have done it wrong. Look at LAMBSE that is what you are commanding.
If your sensors are good then you have serious electrical and wiring problems . IF your sensors are bad then that might explains some things. But the DTC you had 2251 is an electrical or wiring problem and not a bad component.
And the other flashing problems that caused your ECU to lock up also tell me you have electrical problems....You mentioned you had devices hardwired to the car, you have to be really careful with new cars...Maybe you have interference or are getting feedback into the HS canbus or MS canbus which would screw things terribly.
Look at your torque source too...You are getting 1 at WOT. The measured torque is getting truncated which means the ECU is not even seeing or outputting the correct amount of torque which means other actions are interpreting correctly.
Your throttle is never fully opening when you are at WOT it's like half open.
I would replace both primary 02 sensors and strip the car of your hardwired devices and do some logging....But your car is a 2016 so if your 02 sensors are bad you really mangled them on your downpipe install, which makes me thing you have a wiring problem or injected electrical interference into the ECU/canbus/OBD
Some good input (as always) from AJP Turbo.
Subscribed for future updates and learnings...
:popcorn:
Quote from: MiWiAu on January 01, 2017, 11:46:30 PM
Some good input (as always) from AJP Turbo.
Subscribed for future updates and learnings...
:popcorn:
except from the part where hes overlooking its stock and i havnet commanded anything...
Quote from: SHOurpp on January 02, 2017, 11:33:00 AM
Quote from: MiWiAu on January 01, 2017, 11:46:30 PM
Some good input (as always) from AJP Turbo.
Subscribed for future updates and learnings...
:popcorn:
except from the part where hes overlooking its stock and i havnet commanded anything...
LOL. I missed that, too, honestly. The suggestion to replace sensors and remove/disconnect hard wired components still make sense, though.
What sort of electronic add-ons have you done? Did you end up tapping any existing wiring, or were new power/ground circuits run for any aftermarket wiring?
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Quote from: SHOurpp on January 01, 2017, 11:45:02 AM
if ajp is right and the wires got pinched or pulled on the down pipes ,the stft and ltft will default to the working sensor.
thats why they are copies of each other; it throws code because afr isn't reading right
the sensors are perfect-the wires are perfect- there are no leaks anywhere.
im just buying a sensor to test the mechanical theory i stated on page one
i have only a radar detector installed professionally by the stereo-shop - i doubt it has any interference with the car and can be unplugged to prove this theory.
ill look at post from AJP to try to fix this issue as well.
Quote from: SHOurpp on December 27, 2016, 04:10:32 PM
car wot is set for .80 Target but third gear starts going .90-100 even though ive commanded not to lean out???
This is where i got the info from....so i dont think i missed anything ...dont you remember what you posted? I did
Did you look up what the code means that you threw?..doesnt have to do with afr it has to do with wiring.
https://www.yourmechanic.com/article/p2251-obd-ii-trouble-code-o2-sensor-negative-current-control-circuit-open-bank-1-sensor-1-by-jay-safford (https://www.yourmechanic.com/article/p2251-obd-ii-trouble-code-o2-sensor-negative-current-control-circuit-open-bank-1-sensor-1-by-jay-safford)
Professional stereo shops do bonehead things all the time same as dealership mechanics that you pay 90$/hr for
Sometimes they grab power from the easiest and first thing they can
Quote from: AJP turbo on January 02, 2017, 12:23:25 PM
Quote from: SHOurpp on December 27, 2016, 04:10:32 PM
car wot is set for .80 Target but third gear starts going .90-100 even though ive commanded not to lean out???
This is where i got the info from....so i dont think i missed anything ...dont you remember what you posted? I did
Touché. I didn't remember what he posted. :) I've been trying to read more posts, and now I seem to forget things as soon as I read them or they all blend together.
Brad, I bet if you went into the food service industry, you'd be like one of those waiters that can take an order from a party of 20, never write any of it down, and still get everything right. Except, I still don't live in Utah. LOL
Quote from: AJP turbo on January 02, 2017, 12:37:00 PM
Professional stereo shops do bonehead things all the time same as dealership mechanics that you pay 90$/hr for
Sometimes they grab power from the easiest and first thing they can
Ain't that the truth. In my past life, I did low voltage system and wire harness design for off highway construction equipment. Nowadays, I wouldn't even let someone rewire my toaster. Haha
I still remember, probably 16 years ago now, I went into Best Buy to get some bass blockers for some 3.5" car speakers, and they sent me back to the install bay to get them. When I got back there, nobody was in the shop. I went out the back door as one of the "professionals" took off like a bat out of hell down the back alley in a customer's Corvette while a couple other guys watched.
On second thought, maybe they were being thorough and were data logging some WOT runs to make sure the radar they installed wasn't causing any problems. ;) j/k
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Yeah even people that are so called professionals are just doing what they have to until 5:00 then its time to go home
Yeah i dont know why i kept thinking Utah lol i got flooded with people from Utah Colorado and Wyoming and some had the same names....im always trying to correlate forum avatars to people's names
I say burn the f!cking thing to ground and call insurance... Say that stupid radar detector shorted... Get a new SHO... Problem fixed..
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Quote from: AJP turbo on January 02, 2017, 12:23:25 PM
Quote from: SHOurpp on December 27, 2016, 04:10:32 PM
car wot is set for .80 Target but third gear starts going .90-100 even though ive commanded not to lean out???
This is where i got the info from....so i dont think i missed anything ...dont you remember what you posted? I did
Did you look up what the code means that you threw?..doesnt have to do with afr it has to do with wiring.
https://www.yourmechanic.com/article/p2251-obd-ii-trouble-code-o2-sensor-negative-current-control-circuit-open-bank-1-sensor-1-by-jay-safford (https://www.yourmechanic.com/article/p2251-obd-ii-trouble-code-o2-sensor-negative-current-control-circuit-open-bank-1-sensor-1-by-jay-safford)
that was back before
i told everyone the banks were exact copies and the sensor isn't working remember in bold?
Quote from: SHOurpp on January 01, 2017, 08:51:47 PM
here is the log - stock reading
exactly what i posted its right there /\
even the file says
stock - we are beyond that now
your a great help and resource, but seem quick to judge
Quote from: SHOurpp on January 01, 2017, 08:51:47 PM
here is the log - stock reading
exactly what i posted its right there /\
even the file says
stock - we are beyond that now
your a great help and resource, but seem quick to judge
[/quote]
He is actually quite reformed at this point....
You should search his older responses...
Although I am sure if you keep poking the bear he will return to form in no time...
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Quote from: StealBlueSho on January 02, 2017, 03:12:08 PM
Quote from: SHOurpp on January 01, 2017, 08:51:47 PM
here is the log - stock reading
exactly what i posted its right there /\
even the file says stock - we are beyond that now
your a great help and resource, but seem quick to judge
He is actually quite reformed at this point....
You should search his older responses...
Although I am sure if you keep poking the bear he will return to form in no time...
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
[/quote]
i like him! im not poking him-
i called him first to tune for me- you know close to home - we spoke
i wanted alky - he didnt go that route- i respected it - i never called him anything or spoke bad about him
Your posts are hard to read sometimes....but doesn't seem like there is much difference to how your car runs stock or tuned...you also said bank 2 didnt read right when tuned.
All good id say try replacing that 02 that isnt reading and disconnecting those hardwired devices and see if that dtc comes back and logs look better
Can you switch the 02 and see if the problem follows?
Quote from: FoMoCoSHO on January 02, 2017, 03:48:58 PM
Can you switch the 02 and see if the problem follows?
yes - im going to try this
so i get the right one:
the front 02 sensor ,the one that the wire is routed to the cooling fans shroud to lock in place-
is that bank 2 ?if so that is sensor one bank 2
since that side of the block(front of car) is shorter looking in from the passenger side of car view?im guessing it is but not sure.
Bank one is in the back of engine bay and bank two is in the front.
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new sensor in bank 2 sensor 1- reading normal again
has anybody had 3 inch unleashed down pipes trouble?
the bank 2 pipe has the sensor very close if not almost touching the oil cooler and i thought it should have been moved over to clear when we installed but since it finally went i didn't think too much of it.
well somehow the sensor metal body was bent- not sure if we did it on install or motor mounts finished it off but f**king bent!
also
the bank 2 sensor 2 is rubbing the engine cover
i think this pipe (although well made) has fitment issues for both sensors
pis of my rant and clearance so you dont make the same mistake or if you need help choosing whos down pipes to buy
That sensor looks almost as bad as the wideband I installed incorrectly in my 03 mustang and took out on a driveway, except it was bent completely onto itself. One of my widebands has a slight dent in it, but does not cause issue thankfully.
Atleast no issue that I have seen.
As for the oil cooler location, you definitely want it to have ample clearance with regards to engine movement. To be honest, I would either have a new bung welded, or swap to a different brand of downpipe.
I wonder if the 3" downpipes even do much for you compared to a 2.5" PPE or Stainless Works? I think unleashed only sold a few sets and then stopped,
Here is a thread on them that I could find, seems others had a few issues as well: http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php?topic=4701.0 (http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php?topic=4701.0)
I happen to know a few members who have encountered rubbing/rattle issues against the oil cooler and probably explains why they are no longer available. Z Great discussion below.
http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,4291.0.html (http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,4291.0.html)
if i monitor another issue the pipe will just get 2 re positioned bungs welded and 2 plugs in the old holes to correct fitment.which can be done on the car luckily.
- again they are really well made and welded: everything bolts up perfect-
im leaving (i could of over forced that s***) on the table till i can prove otherwise
reset the kam
things look normal so far after a couple days-all o2s good
may try to flash car today
has anyone tried to pull a fuse/clip like the rs to make the car fwd so you can dyno?
from Cobb
https://cobbtuning.atlassian.net/wiki/display/PRS/Ford+Focus+RS+-+Dyno+Preparation
seems like it could work maybe
Quote from: SHOurpp on January 11, 2017, 02:25:35 PM
has anyone tried to pull a fuse/clip like the rs to make the car fwd so you can dyno?
My first time on a non-linked dyno, the tech had to pull fuses. He didn't put them all back when we were done.
Short answer is yes, it's possible, but IMO, you're better off finding a dyno with linked rollers, so you don't have to try to circumvent your onboard systems.
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Quote from: MiWiAu on January 11, 2017, 02:39:06 PM
Quote from: SHOurpp on January 11, 2017, 02:25:35 PM
has anyone tried to pull a fuse/clip like the rs to make the car fwd so you can dyno?
My first time on a non-linked dyno, the tech had to pull fuses. He didn't put them all back when we were done.
Short answer is yes, it's possible, but IMO, you're better off finding a dyno with linked rollers, so you don't have to try to circumvent your onboard systems.
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Yup, 100%!! There are only two linked dynos in my area, only one is a dynojet...and the wait list is FOREVER long.... that shows you how much better it is to use a linked dyno for AWD cars/trucks
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Quote from: StealBlueSho on January 11, 2017, 03:45:41 PM
Quote from: MiWiAu on January 11, 2017, 02:39:06 PM
Quote from: SHOurpp on January 11, 2017, 02:25:35 PM
has anyone tried to pull a fuse/clip like the rs to make the car fwd so you can dyno?
My first time on a non-linked dyno, the tech had to pull fuses. He didn't put them all back when we were done.
Short answer is yes, it's possible, but IMO, you're better off finding a dyno with linked rollers, so you don't have to try to circumvent your onboard systems.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yup, 100%!! There are only two linked dynos in my area, only one is a dynojet...and the wait list is FOREVER long.... that shows you how much better it is to use a linked dyno for AWD cars/trucks
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Linked dyno all the way, DynoJet 424 Anyone?
The shop near me has almost no wait currently, IDK how, but I called monday and had dynotime for yesterday afternoon, no hassle. Lucky me I guess.
Quote from: derfdog15 on January 11, 2017, 03:53:46 PM
Quote from: StealBlueSho on January 11, 2017, 03:45:41 PM
Quote from: MiWiAu on January 11, 2017, 02:39:06 PM
Quote from: SHOurpp on January 11, 2017, 02:25:35 PM
has anyone tried to pull a fuse/clip like the rs to make the car fwd so you can dyno?
My first time on a non-linked dyno, the tech had to pull fuses. He didn't put them all back when we were done.
Short answer is yes, it's possible, but IMO, you're better off finding a dyno with linked rollers, so you don't have to try to circumvent your onboard systems.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yup, 100%!! There are only two linked dynos in my area, only one is a dynojet...and the wait list is FOREVER long.... that shows you how much better it is to use a linked dyno for AWD cars/trucks
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Linked dyno all the way, DynoJet 424 Anyone?
The shop near me has almost no wait currently, IDK how, but I called monday and had dynotime for yesterday afternoon, no hassle. Lucky me I guess.
Try living in Northern Virginia... common statement is "If you see a line just get in it, because by the time you ask what it's for, it's too late!"
Too many people....
who else is having trouble clearing tunes from the x4?
go in to derive,
remove tune from device-
this action will delete-
press ok
then it says" error loading tune copy failed "and it still there.
wtf really? after the second lock up derive actually cleared them-but i still cant today
Please keep the discourse family friendly :)
Quote from: SHOurpp on January 13, 2017, 04:47:41 PM
who else is having trouble clearing tunes from the x4?
go in to derive,
remove tune from device-
this action will delete-
press ok
then it says" error loading tune copy failed "and it still f**king there.
wtf really? after the second lock up derive actually cleared them-but i still cant today
Have you tried uninstalling the Derive software off the computer and reinstalling from a fresh downloaded copy from their website?
I had a lot of anomalies and that cleared them up at one point.
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Quote from: StealBlueSho on January 13, 2017, 06:28:21 PM
Quote from: SHOurpp on January 13, 2017, 04:47:41 PM
who else is having trouble clearing tunes from the x4?
go in to derive,
remove tune from device-
this action will delete-
press ok
then it says" error loading tune copy failed "and it still f**king there.
wtf really? after the second lock up derive actually cleared them-but i still cant today
Have you tried uninstalling the Derive software off the computer and reinstalling from a fresh downloaded copy from their website?
I had a lot of anomalies and that cleared them up at one point.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
no but i will
i only loaded it 46 days ago- thats about as fresh as it gets-
I have this issue every once in a while if I flash a custom tune on top of another. Flash back to stock, then delete whatever files you want on the tuner, it should work.
After that flash back to your desired tune. It has something to do with how the device records what is loaded I believe.
Quote from: derfdog15 on January 13, 2017, 10:47:51 PM
I have this issue every once in a while if I flash a custom tune on top of another. Flash back to stock, then delete whatever files you want on the tuner, it should work.
After that flash back to your desired tune. It has something to do with how the device records what is loaded I believe.
that didn't work
par for the course with the x4
sct tuning issues continued................
ok full factory reset and update has wiped it out clean again
why dont they just tell you that instead of having a menu that shows you can go to and from the device?(IE that only lets you add but not subtract)
I thought they fixed that bug but maybe not...i know they were working on it..you mentioned you had a copy or update performed within 46 days and called it really fresh...that is way outdated.
And sometimes the auto updater for the updater program is faulty....im not talking about the auto updater tab for the actual device
Try to uninstall and redownload the updater program.....does your program have derive on it or sct?