Hello guys just had this weird thing happened, just accelerating maybe 30 - 40% throttle felt truck start shuddering glanced at Gauges and boost pegging 20 psi with 2.2 eng load I instantly let off. Will be running a data log in a few hours once I get out of work but this is bothering me I've never seen over 18 psi or 2.1 load especially part throttle. Truck has been on the same 91 custom tune for 12k miles. Any idea what would cause this? Picture of Livewire min max readings.
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161105/3ac063b4e3d20d1564068168e8042a34.jpg)
Check your vacuum lines here... Mine does that when it pops off the hot pipe there.
Do you monitor wastegate duty cycle? I noticed when mine did that the WGDC dropped to 0 to slow the turbos downs as much as possible.
Didn't see any vacuum lines off and do not have wastegate percent up. I will check when I log it tonight though.
X2 on what SBS said.
Ok just did a quick data log and something is defiantly going on I'm about to put truck back to stock for safety reasons. Help me on this guys as I'm still learning gas side of tuning but here is my quick wot run. I got out of it since I saw knock, rear fuel pressure drop and AFR hitting .5.
I don't know how wastegate percent looks but I'm all open to learning.
I just went through all the vacuum lines they were all tight and connected.
When did you last clean the MAP sensors, and have you verified there is no buildup in the intercooler? The intercooler is still stock, no holes drilled?
Quote from: SHOdded on November 05, 2016, 10:54:24 PM
When did you last clean the MAP sensors, and have you verified there is no buildup in the intercooler? The intercooler is still stock, no holes drilled?
I have not cleaned map sensors is this a normal on ecos just hit 30k miles?. Yes stock intercooler no holes I'm planning on upgrading this winter and save stock one, I can pull off charge pipes to check though. I also just changed the oil and noticed a strong gas odor and sending a sample into blackstone.
Yup it's normal, especially on tuned EBs. Use MAF cleaner/electrical parts cleaner. Easy peasy. Spark plugs are pretty commonly changed by 30K also. Fuel dilution is a common problem on DI engines, and your F150's PCV system may be suffering from excessive blowby. Pulling plugs will tell you if too much fuel is entering the chamber. A compression test will tell you how the piston rings are doing.
How many miles since your last oil change?
Yea... Still seems to me the car loses its vacuum signal from the turbo somewhere...
Yea I did NGK 6510 1 step cooler gapped to .030 at 20k miles I have 28,500 miles on truck. I change the oil every 3-4k miles and it was changed 3 days ago (pennzoil platinum 5w-30). I will have to wait till tomorrow to pull plugs and triple check vacuum lines my garage has my other project in it right now.
You've done everything right, hopefully it is something simple as a sensor or a loose wire. Maybe even a calibration update like they did for the intercooler.
http://ecoboostforum.com/threads/tsb-15-0003-fuel-odor-from-engine-oil-and-or-engine-oil-level-overfull-2011-2014-f150-ecoboost-3-5l.136/ (http://ecoboostforum.com/threads/tsb-15-0003-fuel-odor-from-engine-oil-and-or-engine-oil-level-overfull-2011-2014-f150-ecoboost-3-5l.136/)
2011 Ford Truck F 150 2WD V6-3.5L Turbo
Engine Controls - Raw Fuel Odor in Engine Oil, Oil Overfull
TSB 15-0003
01/15/15
3.5L GTDI - FUEL ODOR FROM ENGINE OIL AND/OR ENGINE OIL LEVEL
OVERFULL
FORD:
2011-2014 F-150
This article supersedes TSB 14-0040 to update the Service Procedure and Part List.
ISSUE
Some 2011-2014 F-150 vehicles equipped with a 3.5L Gasoline Turbocharged Direct Injection (GTDI) engine may exhibit a raw fuel odor from the engine oil and/or an engine oil level indication overfull.
ACTION
Follow the Service Procedure steps to correct the condition.
SERVICE PROCEDURE
1. Determine the part level of the positive crankcase ventilation (PCV) valve by its color. Refer to Workshop Manual (WSM), Section 303-08.
a. If the PCV valve color is black proceed to Step 2.
b. If the PCV valve color is brown proceed to Step 3.
2. Replace the PCV valve. Refer to WSM, Section 303-08.
3. Change the engine oil and filter.
4. Determine the vehicle build date. Refer to WSM, Section 100-01.
a. If the vehicle was built on or before 10/24/2011 proceed to Step 5.
b. If the vehicle was built after 10/24/2011 proceed to Step 9.
(http://www.morepowertuning.com/images/tsb14-0194a.jpg)
5. Remove and discard the brake booster vacuum hose. (Figure 1)
(http://www.morepowertuning.com/images/tsb14-0194b.jpg)
6. Install a new brake booster vacuum hose. (Figure 2)
7. Install a cap over the open port on the air cleaner outlet pipe. (Figure 2)
8. Reprogram the anti-lock brake system (ABS) module to the latest calibration using IDS release 93.02 and higher. Make sure you are connected to the internet when entering module programming to obtain the latest updates. Calibration files may also be obtained at the website.
9. Reprogram the powertrain control module (PCM) to the latest calibration using IDS release 93.02 and higher. Make sure you are connected to the internet when entering module programming to obtain the latest updates. Calibration files may also be obtained at the website.
NOTE : ADVISE THE CUSTOMER THAT THIS VEHICLE IS EQUIPPED WITH AN ADAPTIVE TRANSMISSION SHIFT STRATEGY WHICH ALLOWS THE VEHICLE'S COMPUTER TO LEARN THE TRANSMISSION'S UNIQUE PARAMETERS AND IMPROVE SHIFT QUALITY. WHEN THE ADAPTIVE STRATEGY IS RESET, THE COMPUTER WILL BEGIN A RE-LEARNING PROCESS. THIS RE-LEARNING PROCESS MAY RESULT IN FIRMER THAN NORMAL UPSHIFTS AND DOWNSHIFTS FOR SEVERAL DAYS.
(http://www.morepowertuning.com/images/tsb14-0194c.jpg)
Parts Block
Thanks what do you think of fuel pressure dropping off and afr dropping to .55 I've never seen that?
Quote from: SHOdded on November 05, 2016, 11:42:06 PM
http://ecoboostforum.com/threads/tsb-15-0003-fuel-odor-from-engine-oil-and-or-engine-oil-level-overfull-2011-2014-f150-ecoboost-3-5l.136/ (http://ecoboostforum.com/threads/tsb-15-0003-fuel-odor-from-engine-oil-and-or-engine-oil-level-overfull-2011-2014-f150-ecoboost-3-5l.136/)
2011 Ford Truck F 150 2WD V6-3.5L Turbo
Engine Controls - Raw Fuel Odor in Engine Oil, Oil Overfull
TSB 15-0003
01/15/15
3.5L GTDI - FUEL ODOR FROM ENGINE OIL AND/OR ENGINE OIL LEVEL
OVERFULL
FORD:
2011-2014 F-150
This article supersedes TSB 14-0040 to update the Service Procedure and Part List.
ISSUE
Some 2011-2014 F-150 vehicles equipped with a 3.5L Gasoline Turbocharged Direct Injection (GTDI) engine may exhibit a raw fuel odor from the engine oil and/or an engine oil level indication overfull.
ACTION
Follow the Service Procedure steps to correct the condition.
SERVICE PROCEDURE
1. Determine the part level of the positive crankcase ventilation (PCV) valve by its color. Refer to Workshop Manual (WSM), Section 303-08.
a. If the PCV valve color is black proceed to Step 2.
b. If the PCV valve color is brown proceed to Step 3.
2. Replace the PCV valve. Refer to WSM, Section 303-08.
3. Change the engine oil and filter.
4. Determine the vehicle build date. Refer to WSM, Section 100-01.
a. If the vehicle was built on or before 10/24/2011 proceed to Step 5.
b. If the vehicle was built after 10/24/2011 proceed to Step 9.
(http://www.morepowertuning.com/images/tsb14-0194a.jpg)
5. Remove and discard the brake booster vacuum hose. (Figure 1)
(http://www.morepowertuning.com/images/tsb14-0194b.jpg)
6. Install a new brake booster vacuum hose. (Figure 2)
7. Install a cap over the open port on the air cleaner outlet pipe. (Figure 2)
8. Reprogram the anti-lock brake system (ABS) module to the latest calibration using IDS release 93.02 and higher. Make sure you are connected to the internet when entering module programming to obtain the latest updates. Calibration files may also be obtained at the website.
9. Reprogram the powertrain control module (PCM) to the latest calibration using IDS release 93.02 and higher. Make sure you are connected to the internet when entering module programming to obtain the latest updates. Calibration files may also be obtained at the website.
NOTE : ADVISE THE CUSTOMER THAT THIS VEHICLE IS EQUIPPED WITH AN ADAPTIVE TRANSMISSION SHIFT STRATEGY WHICH ALLOWS THE VEHICLE'S COMPUTER TO LEARN THE TRANSMISSION'S UNIQUE PARAMETERS AND IMPROVE SHIFT QUALITY. WHEN THE ADAPTIVE STRATEGY IS RESET, THE COMPUTER WILL BEGIN A RE-LEARNING PROCESS. THIS RE-LEARNING PROCESS MAY RESULT IN FIRMER THAN NORMAL UPSHIFTS AND DOWNSHIFTS FOR SEVERAL DAYS.
(http://www.morepowertuning.com/images/tsb14-0194c.jpg)
Parts Block
Thanks that definitely sounds like a common issue. I'll see what a UA analyst says then I might have to take it in for that problem.
Ok... so I looked at the logs...
First, you are hitting 20psi because your tune is calling for 19.09psi at WOT.... so you are getting an initial spike of 20psi and the car is trying to hold 19psi...
Second, your AFRs are holding what is being called for.. so during the first portion of the run you are holding .80 lambda but at the end you hit .65 lambda.. again the tune is calling for this so the car is doing it.. actually the tune is calling for .58 but you are only getting to .65....
Third, your Short Term Fuel trims are all over the place during that run... its compensating for something it doesn't like....
Fourth, your wastegate duty cycle looks OK...
Fifth, your throttle is closing during the run.. your trims are pushing +14% which COULD be why but I have seen worse (mine) without the closing... could be in the tune to control the load? Dunno..
Have you flashed your F150 with a new tune lately? It looks to me that everything that is going on.. is because the tune is asking for those things... I am not a tuner, but thats funky to me... I would send the log to your tuner and see what they say before I investigate anything physically with the truck IMHO...
Sixth, I suspect the knock is because your pushing that much of a load... nothing funky there, just a symptom of a lot of load...
Seventh, you spark is NEGATIVE through the whole run... I have never seen that....
Again, looks a lot like the the tune is dorked up...
Eighth, the fuel pressure is dropping so bad because your car cant keep up with the load being requested and the requested afr (LAMBASE) at the same time.. something has gotta give and the fuel pressure usually goes first since the car tries to do everything it can to keep LAMBASE ....
Thanks a lot!! Yea spark going negative is weird comparing to my track log a few months ago. I did have my tow tune on for two weeks and put my performance tune back on about a week ago but never had anything like this happen iv ran probably logged 6-8k miles on this current tune. Here's anther 1/4 mile log of the same tune from August defiantly looks a lot better.
I am sure all tuners are now aware of the cold weather issues, but there is an ambient temp drop of 20F, plus possibly a winter gas issue involved. In CO, you only get 91 right? So running "91" gas might not be enough anymore.
Ok, so that good run is a full multigear run... Interesting though that you are saying you dont normally see 20PSI but in the good run you are spiking that high as well. Actually, the good run looks very similar to the bad run you sent as far as load, boost, timing, etc... being a mile high above sea level explains the high WGDC numbers... air is thin up there...
I would agree with the SHOdded on this one, looks like the winter gas is killing your fuel pressure and giving you knock issues now.
Your tuner is giving you BIG boost and little to no timing advance.. probably much less than stock? I have not seen timing that low on a Ecoboost datalog before, but to be fair, I don't normally look at the F150 datalogs...
I would run that bad boy stock until the summer blends come back IMHO
I would suggest trying a fuel stabilizer or octane booster which have proven to have negligible results for winter-blend gas and monitor for any changes. Z
Steal blue is is pretty accurate with the assessment...It's a pretty unrefined tune if tuned at all...Desired TIP is all over the place along with commanded AFR...Fuel enrichment looks like it was left stock along with the commanded boost..Maybe just globally increased.
Spark on a lot of ecoboost engines is really low compared to the SHO but there is a big difference between the logs
I would be comfortable running that with those huge dips in fuel pressure.
I wouldn't be so quick to say it's just winter fuel...Could be a lot of less than ideal things adding up to a problematic tune.
boosted150- i'm in CO as well and have a couple stations that i know have verified good fuel. i'm tuned by AJP and fuel quality hasn't been an issue-even as of late with possible winter blends.what part of town are you in? id be happy to share.
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i would say i think the issue is with your tune overall-but getting good fuel would rule one thing out at least
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Quote from: SHOdded on November 06, 2016, 07:30:01 AM
I am sure all tuners are now aware of the cold weather issues, but there is an ambient temp drop of 20F, plus possibly a winter gas issue involved. In CO, you only get 91 right? So running "91" gas might not be enough anymore.
Yes we only get the crap 91 octane.
Quote from: StealBlueSho on November 06, 2016, 07:41:59 AM
Ok, so that good run is a full multigear run... Interesting though that you are saying you dont normally see 20PSI but in the good run you are spiking that high as well. Actually, the good run looks very similar to the bad run you sent as far as load, boost, timing, etc... being a mile high above sea level explains the high WGDC numbers... air is thin up there...
I would agree with the SHOdded on this one, looks like the winter gas is killing your fuel pressure and giving you knock issues now.
Your tuner is giving you BIG boost and little to no timing advance.. probably much less than stock? I have not seen timing that low on a Ecoboost datalog before, but to be fair, I don't normally look at the F150 datalogs...
I would run that bad boy stock until the summer blends come back IMHO
My bad I guess I should look into logs more still new to data logging, I just never have never seen 20 lbs and load over 2 on live wire programmer screen maybe it's off a little or something. And rarely seen knock levels above 2 under wot.
Quote from: 8nutz8 on November 06, 2016, 12:56:36 PM
boosted150- i'm in CO as well and have a couple stations that i know have verified good fuel. i'm tuned by AJP and fuel quality hasn't been an issue-even as of late with possible winter blends.what part of town are you in? id be happy to share.
I live in Thornton yeah I would love to find some local ecoboost guys or tuner shop is AJP local?
Quote from: 8nutz8 on November 06, 2016, 12:57:45 PM
i would say i think the issue is with your tune overall-but getting good fuel would rule one thing out at least
Yes I put the truck back to stock will be talking with my tuner again but I have a quarter tank left to run out before I can refill.
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i'll pm you with a reply boosted150. don't want to clutter the thread.
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