Does anyone think it is possible to fit the 11-14 Mustang Brembo's on a PP SHO as a cheaper alternative to the Willwood setup
Have you priced out a new set of Brembo's from Ford?
And more importantly, have you factored in w/e related addt'l costs would be involved in modifying them to work on a SHO?
I ask, because I'd be hard pressed to say you'll arrive at a cheaper price point than the Wilwood's.
Not to mention the outstanding support & service one receives from Todd @ TCE Performance is beyond reproach.
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Quote from: zach_435 on March 11, 2016, 01:35:44 PM
Does anyone think it is possible to fit the 11-14 Mustang Brembo's on a PP SHO as a cheaper alternative to the Willwood setup
If it was that easy someone would have already done it. If you want a brake kit go with the existing kit with the Wilwoods which designed to work with your car and all of its other braking components like the master cylinder.
Just my $.02
The reason I ask is because I have a set at my house just wanted to see if anyone had attempted it before I think about doing.
If they bolt right up what other thing do I need to know after installing them to make sure they will function properly
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What does this Brembo setup consist of, and are there known measurements? I'd post pics & measurements, that would help members give you a more informed opinion.
Quote from: zach_435 on March 11, 2016, 03:07:33 PM
The reason I ask is because I have a set at my house just wanted to see if anyone had attempted it before I think about doing.
If they bolt right up what other thing do I need to know after installing them to make sure they will function properly
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First see if they will even bolt up but to save some grief at least try to measure the mounting bolt spacing first.
A few basic things off of the top of my head:
Piston sizes for the calipers to calculate how much fluid it will take for them to work vs the stock calipers. If they will require more fluid to work you may need to research a larger master cylinder.
What rotor will work based on the caliper when mounted. Stock or ??
What thickness range rotor is the caliper designed for vs what you will use. To thin of a rotor may allow the pistons to extend to far to be safe.
Rotor height to have rotor centered in the caliper.
If they don't even bolt up none of the above matters.
ok ill have to take a look at it when i get home.
what is the size of the factory PP rotor?
Also since calipers need the bleeders to be at the top when mounted I don't think it will work even if they bolt up. I say this because I seem to remember that mustangs mount the calipers on the back/trailing edge of the disc and SHO calipers are on the front side. If the brembos have an external brake line which connects the two sides of the caliper you may be able to move it to the other end of the caliper and switch it with the bleeders to correct this.
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I had mustang brembos that i sold so i could put on gt500 calipers and rotors.....i was going to try and put the stock gt brembos on the sho but it didnt look like the calipers would bolt to the knuckles
You likely would have to have an adapter made so the brembos would mount to the knuckle...those are machined pieces with precise top to bottom and left to right dimensions so the rotors sits correct on the rotor..and rotor diamter is not the only thing to worry about...hat thickness and geometry comes into play on where the final position of the rotor face will be
Quote from: ajpturbo on March 11, 2016, 04:27:17 PM
I had mustang brembos that i sold so i could put on gt500 calipers and rotors.....i was going to try and put the stock gt brembos on the sho but it didnt look like the calipers would bolt to the knuckles
You likely would have to have an adapter made so the brembos would mount to the knuckle...those are machined pieces with precise top to bottom and left to right dimensions so the rotors sits correct on the rotor..and rotor diamter is not the only thing to worry about...hat thickness and geometry comes into play on where the final position of the rotor face will be
The 5.0 is on a diet compared to the SHO. I wouldn't imagine the 5.0 brakes would be work it imo for such a heavy car. I wonder how they compare to the wilwoods though.
Quote from: Excalibur on March 11, 2016, 08:02:14 PM
Quote from: ajpturbo on March 11, 2016, 04:27:17 PM
I had mustang brembos that i sold so i could put on gt500 calipers and rotors.....i was going to try and put the stock gt brembos on the sho but it didnt look like the calipers would bolt to the knuckles
You likely would have to have an adapter made so the brembos would mount to the knuckle...those are machined pieces with precise top to bottom and left to right dimensions so the rotors sits correct on the rotor..and rotor diamter is not the only thing to worry about...hat thickness and geometry comes into play on where the final position of the rotor face will be
The 5.0 is on a diet compared to the SHO. I wouldn't imagine the 5.0 brakes would be work it imo for such a heavy car. I wonder how they compare to the wilwoods though.
True, but the track pack equipped mustangs have the same size front rotors as my pp sho but with better calipers than the sho , being 4 pot brembos...and like the pp sho , the track pack stang uses a performance pad which i bet is similar if not Identical to the pp sho pads being that they are from ford
So actually they are probably pretty equal..the mustang having a better front caliper but the sho having a slightly larger rear disc...pads would be about the same and front rotors being the same diameter...and i wouldnt call the rear smaller rotors a disadvantage in the stang considering there really is no weight back there
Quote from: ajpturbo on March 11, 2016, 09:03:57 PM
Quote from: Excalibur on March 11, 2016, 08:02:14 PM
Quote from: ajpturbo on March 11, 2016, 04:27:17 PM
I had mustang brembos that i sold so i could put on gt500 calipers and rotors.....i was going to try and put the stock gt brembos on the sho but it didnt look like the calipers would bolt to the knuckles
You likely would have to have an adapter made so the brembos would mount to the knuckle...those are machined pieces with precise top to bottom and left to right dimensions so the rotors sits correct on the rotor..and rotor diamter is not the only thing to worry about...hat thickness and geometry comes into play on where the final position of the rotor face will be
The 5.0 is on a diet compared to the SHO. I wouldn't imagine the 5.0 brakes would be work it imo for such a heavy car. I wonder how they compare to the wilwoods though.
True, but the track pack equipped mustangs have the same size front rotors as my pp sho but with better calipers than the sho , being 4 pot brembos...and like the pp sho , the track pack stang uses a performance pad which i bet is similar if not Identical to the pp sho pads being that they are from ford
So actually they are probably pretty equal..the mustang having a better front caliper but the sho having a slightly larger rear disc...pads would be about the same and front rotors being the same diameter...and i wouldnt call the rear smaller rotors a disadvantage in the stang considering there really is no weight back there
I have a pp sho and track pack 5.0 as well and always thought of them as about equal. I just couldn't see the 5.0 brembos as an upgrade is all I was saying. They aren't even sufficient for tracking for an extended period of time even after a fluid change with a higher boiling point and better pads.
"We're told that the 2013 SHO with the Performance Package can now withstand 30-plus hot laps at Michigan's Grattan Raceway"
http://www.motortrend.com/news/2013-ford-taurus-sho-first-drive/ (http://www.motortrend.com/news/2013-ford-taurus-sho-first-drive/)
http://grattanracewaypark.com/aboutus.html (http://grattanracewaypark.com/aboutus.html)
Quote from: Excalibur on March 11, 2016, 10:25:40 PM
Quote from: ajpturbo on March 11, 2016, 09:03:57 PM
Quote from: Excalibur on March 11, 2016, 08:02:14 PM
Quote from: ajpturbo on March 11, 2016, 04:27:17 PM
I had mustang brembos that i sold so i could put on gt500 calipers and rotors.....i was going to try and put the stock gt brembos on the sho but it didnt look like the calipers would bolt to the knuckles
You likely would have to have an adapter made so the brembos would mount to the knuckle...those are machined pieces with precise top to bottom and left to right dimensions so the rotors sits correct on the rotor..and rotor diamter is not the only thing to worry about...hat thickness and geometry comes into play on where the final position of the rotor face will be
The 5.0 is on a diet compared to the SHO. I wouldn't imagine the 5.0 brakes would be work it imo for such a heavy car. I wonder how they compare to the wilwoods though.
True, but the track pack equipped mustangs have the same size front rotors as my pp sho but with better calipers than the sho , being 4 pot brembos...and like the pp sho , the track pack stang uses a performance pad which i bet is similar if not Identical to the pp sho pads being that they are from ford
So actually they are probably pretty equal..the mustang having a better front caliper but the sho having a slightly larger rear disc...pads would be about the same and front rotors being the same diameter...and i wouldnt call the rear smaller rotors a disadvantage in the stang considering there really is no weight back there
I have a pp sho and track pack 5.0 as well and always thought of them as about equal. I just couldn't see the 5.0 brembos as an upgrade is all I was saying. They aren't even sufficient for tracking for an extended period of time even after a fluid change with a higher boiling point and better pads.
We are like twinkies...however i put twin turbos on my track pack 14' mustang lol....the title track pack is a bit of a stretch...i dont think anything u get from a dealer will fare well on a track as far as the brakes go...i think there is a huge difference between sport brakes and track ready brakes
Quote from: ajpturbo on March 11, 2016, 10:47:26 PM
Quote from: Excalibur on March 11, 2016, 10:25:40 PM
Quote from: ajpturbo on March 11, 2016, 09:03:57 PM
Quote from: Excalibur on March 11, 2016, 08:02:14 PM
Quote from: ajpturbo on March 11, 2016, 04:27:17 PM
I had mustang brembos that i sold so i could put on gt500 calipers and rotors.....i was going to try and put the stock gt brembos on the sho but it didnt look like the calipers would bolt to the knuckles
You likely would have to have an adapter made so the brembos would mount to the knuckle...those are machined pieces with precise top to bottom and left to right dimensions so the rotors sits correct on the rotor..and rotor diamter is not the only thing to worry about...hat thickness and geometry comes into play on where the final position of the rotor face will be
The 5.0 is on a diet compared to the SHO. I wouldn't imagine the 5.0 brakes would be work it imo for such a heavy car. I wonder how they compare to the wilwoods though.
True, but the track pack equipped mustangs have the same size front rotors as my pp sho but with better calipers than the sho , being 4 pot brembos...and like the pp sho , the track pack stang uses a performance pad which i bet is similar if not Identical to the pp sho pads being that they are from ford
So actually they are probably pretty equal..the mustang having a better front caliper but the sho having a slightly larger rear disc...pads would be about the same and front rotors being the same diameter...and i wouldnt call the rear smaller rotors a disadvantage in the stang considering there really is no weight back there
I have a pp sho and track pack 5.0 as well and always thought of them as about equal. I just couldn't see the 5.0 brembos as an upgrade is all I was saying. They aren't even sufficient for tracking for an extended period of time even after a fluid change with a higher boiling point and better pads.
We are like twinkies...however i put twin turbos on my track pack 14' mustang lol....the title track pack is a bit of a stretch...i dont think anything u get from a dealer will fare well on a track as far as the brakes go...i think there is a huge difference between sport brakes and track ready brakes
Send me a turbo kit for my 5.0, so we can keep the twinkees ball rolling. I have a complete bmr suspension, cj monoblade setup with 373's for the 5.0 currently. My last one was a brenspeed 650r package. I wanted to go a different route with this one. I feel the n/a cj setup with the 373's is adequate for being a well rounded track setup as well as a daily driver if I wrecked the sho for some reason. I wouldn't kick a turbo setup out of bed however. It would fair nice with the cj setup imo.
I honestly don't think you'd gain much unless you went to the 15" 13-14' GT500 style.
Seriously I smile every time I get nasty on these brakes. SO much better than the piece of crap Marauder brakes I was used to for my daily.
Thought I would add some info since I have done a lot of research into brakes for both the Taurus and my project (Merkur XR4ti).
Stock 10-12 Master cylinder is 1.062" (1 1/16")
I cannot confirm the 13+ Master Cylinder size, but I've found 1.25" which is a 12% increase in area. Napa listed the front portion as 1.5", but I cannot fathom that size, which doubles the area, so I'm going with the 1.25")
Piston area:
Front: 5.49" (2x47.5mm/1.87")
Rear: 2.25" (1x43mm/1.69")
The Mustang Brembo brakes use a 1.062" Master cylinder.
Piston area:
Front: 4.3" (40/44mm) a 28% decrease compared to stock
Rear: same 43mm piston as the Taurus
A big problem with the Brembos is the size (height mainly) of the pads. It will require the use of the Mustang 14" rotor, which is NOT hub centric and nobody makes a centering ring that will work, so more custom work. Or a custom 14" rotor, which are in the ~$250 a piece range. The caliper will not bolt right up. Wilwoods will work on the stock 13+ rotor, so a simple Caliper upgrade is viable.
Getting the same "feel" as the 13+ can be done by simply going with a smaller piston area caliper, which are available from Wilwood to within 1% of the stock area in proportion to the smaller master. That is based on my assumption that both the front and rear pistons are the same 1.25" on the 13+ Taurus.