I had a run in with a large animal on Thanksgiving night. Yesterday the guys at the shop removed the broken under panel that encloses the area underneath the ac condenser, radiator and inter cooler. I did notice on the way home, which is an hour drive that the faster I went the more my temp needle would drop..... I happened to just get lucky enough that a new edge mustang guy was beating up on a Toyota corolla (the abuse was relentless) so I followed chase. Once we we in the clear he floored it and he couldn't shake me. I was on his bumper like stink on s***!! When we slowed and got side by side, I was in M mode in 3rd, we tried it again and I just started pulling him. He pulled in behind me to I guess get in my draft, but once I threw 5th it was bye bye birdie. Now the strangest thing, the car was pulling like never before... I mean the top end pull was nasty. I've never gone into triple digits so fast. Pulled to 140 and just kept going... After all said and done I looked at the temp gauge and it was reading around 1/4 up from cold. As I drove at 70 a few seconds the temp started coming back to its normal resting spot a tad below half way. Someone out there want to take off their lower front cover and test this? I would bet anything my car is stronger, it's gotta be the intercooler getting that much more air. To whoever tries this, you have to tie strap the lower fender apron to the frame to keep them from hitting the tire and ruining them. (http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/11/30/qupy3avy.jpg)(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/11/30/a2yqa8u6.jpg)
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Very interesting. What mods? Think about putting a signature in so people don't have yo ask.
Car mods are Airaid intake, stg 4 LMS tune and 170* thermostat.
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I'll have to check that out next week.
I'll give it a shot I'll have to look at this again first to see what exactly is being removed though. Any downside to whatever you removed other that some zip ties needed ?
I wouldn't take mine off. All those pieces on the front end are all tied together to support themselves. I had my front clip off twice. It's fastened underneath, on top and on the sides to the inner fender walls. I'm glad at 140 the whole front end didn't fly off.
realistically it was probably just the cool night air. i know my stock SHO feel noticeable faster when the sun goes down and then temps get into the 30s.
The other (negative) experience previously reported by others (including my own) where owners have removed these under belly covers (both the larger, and the smaller one as discussed in this thread) have been noticeable, vertical flopping of the engine hood at speeds in excess of 120mph.
Creep closer to 140+ (like I have) that hood shaking becomes much more pronounced.
I believe part of the design (of the under belly pans) was to actually help air flow and overall aerodynamics versus removing them altogether.
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after looking at it again I think I would be afraid to open that up to taking a rock to the intercooler, or a/c condenser and getting a leak. I had a rock take out the a/c condenser on my previous G35.
bdp1151 is your enire front lower grill section open in the front ? I might would try that I wonder if that lower grill section just pops out ?
that also makes me wonder if our cars would benefit from a larger intercooler then ?
Quote from: 68_GT on December 01, 2013, 10:42:35 PM
that also makes me wonder if our cars would benefit from a larger intercooler then ?
4DR did one.. not sure what thread, sorry.... it has all the picks and performance stats
Quote from: BiGMaC on December 01, 2013, 10:53:50 PM
Quote from: 68_GT on December 01, 2013, 10:42:35 PM
that also makes me wonder if our cars would benefit from a larger intercooler then ?
4DR did one.. not sure what thread, sorry.... it has all the picks and performance stats
so there was some performance gains ? Funny I also thought I saw somewhere that our intercoolers are plenty big or almost oversized for the ecoboost engines already.
Maybe 4DR will chime in... he is much better equipped to answer your question.
Quote from: 68_GT on December 01, 2013, 10:42:35 PM
that also makes me wonder if our cars would benefit from a larger intercooler then ?
I've had over 30 turbocharged cars and EVERY one that I upgraded the IC on made noticeably more power. A few years back, I had a DOHC 2.2 Dodge Rampage that was running almost perfectly and consistantly for months. The day before heading to a race in Vegas, the IC size was doubled, it ran so much stronger I couldn't belive it :thumbsup: Turns out that it moved so much more air, it leaned out the AFR's and holed a piston in Vegas :(
The first thing I noticed peeking thru the grill when I got my Sport is how SMALL the stock IC is AND that it's not a very efficient design. It has relativley few long tubes that run the length of the core, this style leads to high backpressure and higher temps than an IC that has multiple shorter tubes. I have one left over from a previous build that I think will fit after modifying the outlet to 3" and moving it to the other end of the endtank. I'm gonna build the downpipes first, have my exhaust guy build an entirely new system(I'm still collecting parts, I have almost everything but the first muffler I ordred isn't gonna work) Install the LMS tune and then install this IC. I'll have some feedback after that. Here's the IC.
Hey AJ, you got that $200 you owe me? JK Really, it's great to have another pioneer here in the world of Ecoboosts! Good luck with you endeavors!
I'll take pics of the downpipes and exhaust install as well as all the other upgrades,I have a couple power producing ideas I haven't seen talked about on the EB boards (I have over 1400pics on Turbo-Mopar.com my home away from home Check it out if you're bored, I'm 2.216VTurbo over there) it's gonna be 'Purty :boink: This is gonna be a fun vehical to mod :rock:
Quote from: QuickSilver on December 02, 2013, 09:27:58 PM
I'll take pics of the downpipes and exhaust install as well as all the other upgrades,I have a couple power producing ideas I haven't seen talked about on the EB boards (I have over 1400pics on Turbo-Mopar.com my home away from home Check it out if you're bored, I'm 2.216VTurbo over there) it's gonna be 'Purty :boink: This is gonna be a fun vehical to mod :rock:
Do share, always nice to see mods come together for a great build.
I've been driving without the lower cover since Thursday and can report the car runs cooler at high speeds. I don't mean at 55 or 60 I've had the car over 140 and the temp has dropped noticeably. Once I slow to normal speeds the temp climbs to normal. I haven't seen the "hood shake" as reported earlier. I drive 100 miles a day 5-6 days a week and at 5:00am the roads are just begging me to open the car up. No ill effects to report on as of yet. I guess my only gripe is that I can see the ground through my lower grill opening. I'm going to remove the other engine cover this week just for shits and giggles.
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^I can't remember if you said or not Racer140, do you have the cooler 170degree T Stat? I agree with the poster that said turbo cars run better on a cooler day/night(especially since they are ofter tuned rich for safety sake) but if your car runs noticeably stronger just by managing the airflow differently, well then that's time to consider making changes 8) Makes me wonder if the new police package grill which is clearly different and more 'open flow' than the Sport grill will be available for order from dealerships...
I experienced the same issue as BDP Mike when I drove my car at triple digits speeds with my 2010 when the under cover was removed... The hood was shaking and not felt safe at all. Maybe it is different with the 2013 with the hood being different? That said, I prefer to keep it for protection from rocks or other things that could damage internal parts. Also, I believe that the airflow and aerodynamic is probably better with it. With Tstat170F and tune, my water temps are always under 180F regardless of the outside temperature. Even now, with temperatures in the 20's, it is always between 170-180F.
So, I really don't think the under cover has anything to do with engine performance. The faster you go, the more air you get and it evacuates anyways. When you drive at 140 mph, even with the undercover, the air is evacuating very fast believe me.
I ran at the track many many many many times (500+) with the 2010 and 2013 SHOs with and without the under cover and it makes no difference at all, beside the risk of damages and perhaps hood shaking and aerodynamic not as efficient.
Engine cover however is a different thing I think. It doesn't hurt the aerodynamics when removed, heat can evacuate better especially when not driving fast (between runs or at idle) and you save 1lb! lol
On a side note, the cover below the engine does one of the best jobs of keeping the engine bay clean of any vehicle I have ever owned. Especially nice with the heavy doses of sand and salt they use in the Northeast.
I'd want to see some performance numbers to back up removing that cover before I would do it. While removing it doesn't seem like a great long term idea what if one were to create some cutouts with a mesh covering to keep out rocks but allow for increased airflow?
Quote from: steve142857 on December 03, 2013, 10:00:56 AM
I experienced the same issue as BDP Mike when I drove my car at triple digits speeds with my 2010 when the under cover was removed... The hood was shaking and not felt safe at all. Maybe it is different with the 2013 with the hood being different? That said, I prefer to keep it for protection from rocks or other things that could damage internal parts. Also, I believe that the airflow and aerodynamic is probably better with it. With Tstat170F and tune, my water temps are always under 180F regardless of the outside temperature. Even now, with temperatures in the 20's, it is always between 170-180F.
So, I really don't think the under cover has anything to do with engine performance. The faster you go, the more air you get and it evacuates anyways. When you drive at 140 mph, even with the undercover, the air is evacuating very fast believe me.
I ran at the track many many many many times (500+) with the 2010 and 2013 SHOs with and without the under cover and it makes no difference at all, beside the risk of damages and perhaps hood shaking and aerodynamic not as efficient.
Engine cover however is a different thing I think. It doesn't hurt the aerodynamics when removed, heat can evacuate better especially when not driving fast (between runs or at idle) and you save 1lb! lol
I think he's saying the added performance was from more airflow over the intercooler and some maybe from the lower engine temps, but certainly is noticing lower engine temps at 140 mph.
I got my 2013 upto 100-110 mph on a wide open toll road today and I noticed the hood shakeing. All my high powered Mustangs had hood pins. Would look terrible on a SHO but I had an aftermarket hood open up on me once at 70mph on my 708 rwhp Mustang.
Quote from: QuickSilver on December 02, 2013, 05:31:43 PM
Quote from: 68_GT on December 01, 2013, 10:42:35 PM
that also makes me wonder if our cars would benefit from a larger intercooler then ?
I've had over 30 turbocharged cars and EVERY one that I upgraded the IC on made noticeably more power. A few years back, I had a DOHC 2.2 Dodge Rampage that was running almost perfectly and consistantly for months. The day before heading to a race in Vegas, the IC size was doubled, it ran so much stronger I couldn't belive it :thumbsup: Turns out that it moved so much more air, it leaned out the AFR's and holed a piston in Vegas :(
The first thing I noticed peeking thru the grill when I got my Sport is how SMALL the stock IC is AND that it's not a very efficient design. It has relativley few long tubes that run the length of the core, this style leads to high backpressure and higher temps than an IC that has multiple shorter tubes. I have one left over from a previous build that I think will fit after modifying the outlet to 3" and moving it to the other end of the endtank. I'm gonna build the downpipes first, have my exhaust guy build an entirely new system(I'm still collecting parts, I have almost everything but the first muffler I ordred isn't gonna work) Install the LMS tune and then install this IC. I'll have some feedback after that. Here's the IC.
dont you want to install that IC then have it tuned to be sure you're not running lean ?
I wonder if LMS can adjust my tune just for an intercooler by e-mail ???
Which IC is that and how much did it run you ?
thanks
Sounds reasonable, but as earlier stated they engineered those panels for air flow and I believe the naca/nasa type vent is aimed at directing air to the PTU to keep things cool. I also heard of crazy vibration at speed with removal of panel items.
what about removal of the complete lower grill to increase airflow to the intercooler ?
my 2013 had the sides of the lower grill completely blocked. I'm sure there is an aftermarket grill, or maybe a 2013 Police Interceptor lower grill that would allow for more airflow through the lower grill.
Are they easy to remove ? I might consider temporarily removing my lower grill completely and drive it to see if it helps any.