Has anyone observed BRAND or VISCOSITY of oil affecting spark stability at high rpm?
Im back to full meth+tune, IE back to the state i was prior to #2 injector flooding/wrecking my block. But i am seeing in third gear where it holds rpm longer +1 knock where i did not before. Im on the same plugs .. same fueling station but i have changed oil vendors to oil can Henry's synthetic Valvoline.
it 'could be gas' but i have doubts, but the oil brand switch is major and suspect in my head... buuuut i defer to wiser folks... thoughts?
Which oil were you using before? If the viscosity is correct, hard to imagine the oil causing the knock, particularly Valvoline.
I've always used sp534 plugs at .028.. Without issue but step colder plugs really should be used in your application with more boost and meth. Again I haven't had issues with said plugs but bc they are inferior I switched to sp542 plugs at .028. For whatever it's worth bc I also run meth in my 2010 non PP, I've had no issues with Royal Purple 5w-20. Mostly made the switch after seeing a video of knock occurring with tuned SHO with sp534....then same tuned SHO with sp542...knock gone!
https://youtu.be/Zqz8AdJMxTY
What you decide to do is entirely up to you.
FWIW I would also question the quality of the Meth!
New Tune,would give it some time to relearn the Trans adaptives. Z
ugh i know its the plugs in my dark muttering heart... but i hate doing plugs on this car. I think the Meth is good its a new can and i run 100% only. i will change gas stations and reevaluate.
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 10:04:39 AM
ugh i know its the plugs in my dark muttering heart... but i hate doing plugs on this car. I think the Meth is good its a new can and i run 100% only. i will change gas stations and reevaluate.
Dude, plugs are easy. Get a swivel extension. Makes life so much easier.
Im getting a touch of knock up top. I'm suspecting it's the plugs too. I'm gonna try swapping in the sp542's this weekend.
Quote from: SM105K on June 05, 2019, 10:28:45 AM
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 10:04:39 AM
ugh i know its the plugs in my dark muttering heart... but i hate doing plugs on this car. I think the Meth is good its a new can and i run 100% only. i will change gas stations and reevaluate.
Dude, plugs are easy. Get a swivel extension. Makes life so much easier.
After doing it once without a swivel...bought a swivel and so much better...but those back 3 still a pain...but anything is compared to the easy front! I take my rear blow off valve off
i have big hands, so those back three just suck... :( i have the 542's but there .30 gapped. My best spark was the irridum's from ngk, i had amazing spark back then. but the damn things lasted literally 12,000 miles and the tips ate off. >:(
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 10:43:02 AM
i have big hands, so those back three just suck... :( i have the 542's but there .30 gapped. My best spark was the irridum's from ngk, i had amazing spark back then. but the damn things lasted literally 12,000 miles and the tips ate off. >:(
Damn! If you have the 542s Idk...does spark gap from .028 to .030 make so much of a difference ? I'm not a gaptologist so maybe someone else can chime in
Quote from: 802SHO on June 05, 2019, 10:45:43 AM
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 10:43:02 AM
i have big hands, so those back three just suck... :( i have the 542's but there .30 gapped. My best spark was the irridum's from ngk, i had amazing spark back then. but the damn things lasted literally 12,000 miles and the tips ate off. >:(
Damn! If you have the 542s Idk...does spark gap from .028 to .030 make so much of a difference ? I'm not a gaptologist so maybe someone else can chime in
From what I know these cars really don't have spark blow out issues. I think meth is killing the tips. Meth is extremely corrosive.
on the old NGK's it was, the last set of 542's lasted almost a year and i only replace them when the injector went bad and i was unsure if it was that or a head gasket ..
Quote from: SM105K on June 05, 2019, 11:04:39 AM
Quote from: 802SHO on June 05, 2019, 10:45:43 AM
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 10:43:02 AM
i have big hands, so those back three just suck... :( i have the 542's but there .30 gapped. My best spark was the irridum's from ngk, i had amazing spark back then. but the damn things lasted literally 12,000 miles and the tips ate off. >:(
Damn! If you have the 542s Idk...does spark gap from .028 to .030 make so much of a difference ? I'm not a gaptologist so maybe someone else can chime in
From what I know these cars really don't have spark blow out issues. I think meth is killing the tips. Meth is extremely corrosive.
Its the wideband 02's that take a beating! Spark blowout is sometimes in question,with sufficient Blow by! Z :(
Quote from: ZSHO on June 05, 2019, 12:21:58 PM
Quote from: SM105K on June 05, 2019, 11:04:39 AM
Quote from: 802SHO on June 05, 2019, 10:45:43 AM
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 10:43:02 AM
i have big hands, so those back three just suck... :( i have the 542's but there .30 gapped. My best spark was the irridum's from ngk, i had amazing spark back then. but the damn things lasted literally 12,000 miles and the tips ate off. >:(
Damn! If you have the 542s Idk...does spark gap from .028 to .030 make so much of a difference ? I'm not a gaptologist so maybe someone else can chime in
From what I know these cars really don't have spark blow out issues. I think meth is killing the tips. Meth is extremely corrosive.
Its the wideband 02's that take a beating! Spark blowout is in question,with sufficient Blow by! Z :(
While changing the wideband O2's my hands are what took the beating lol.
Quote from: SM105K on June 05, 2019, 12:28:13 PM
Quote from: ZSHO on June 05, 2019, 12:21:58 PM
Quote from: SM105K on June 05, 2019, 11:04:39 AM
Quote from: 802SHO on June 05, 2019, 10:45:43 AM
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 10:43:02 AM
i have big hands, so those back three just suck... :( i have the 542's but there .30 gapped. My best spark was the irridum's from ngk, i had amazing spark back then. but the damn things lasted literally 12,000 miles and the tips ate off. >:(
Damn! If you have the 542s Idk...does spark gap from .028 to .030 make so much of a difference ? I'm not a gaptologist so maybe someone else can chime in
From what I know these cars really don't have spark blow out issues. I think meth is killing the tips. Meth is extremely corrosive.
Its the wideband 02's that take a beating! Spark blowout is in question,with sufficient Blow by! Z :(
While changing the wideband O2's my hands are what took the beating lol.
I see why Tropher is so hesitant.! Lol. Z :D
Great, I have so much to look forward to, changing my wideband sensors tomorrow.....
Quote from: ZSHO on June 05, 2019, 12:21:58 PM
Quote from: SM105K on June 05, 2019, 11:04:39 AM
Quote from: 802SHO on June 05, 2019, 10:45:43 AM
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 10:43:02 AM
i have big hands, so those back three just suck... :( i have the 542's but there .30 gapped. My best spark was the irridum's from ngk, i had amazing spark back then. but the damn things lasted literally 12,000 miles and the tips ate off. >:(
Damn! If you have the 542s Idk...does spark gap from .028 to .030 make so much of a difference ? I'm not a gaptologist so maybe someone else can chime in
From what I know these cars really don't have spark blow out issues. I think meth is killing the tips. Meth is extremely corrosive.
Its the wideband 02's that take a beating! Spark blowout is sometimes in question,with sufficient Blow by! Z :(
heh, if i have blow by on a new broke-in block imma be super pissed and set the while kit on fire ...
I rest the KMS using the handheld .. will get some !!SUPERGAS!! and observe the spark .. if it still has issues them next oil change i will go back to what was previously administrated when i ran 12.6's..
after that i will be pissed, ranty and annoyed and then in a huff scar my hands some more and change plugs back to NGK's i had running the 12.6's and hope the bad tips i had previously were because of leaky injectors.
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 03:21:07 PM
I rest the KMS using the handheld .. will get some !!SUPERGAS!! and observe the spark .. if it still has issues them next oil change i will go back to what was previously administrated when i ran 12.6's..
after that i will be pissed, ranty and annoyed and then in a huff scar my hands some more and change plugs back to NGK's i had running the 12.6's and hope the bad tips i had previously were because of leaky injectors.
Run Castrol Edge in her and be done with it.
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=5931324&jsn=258 (https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=5931324&jsn=258)
so MC says 2 year warranty... but ford and experience says 20k miles at BEST .. shouldn't we be getting rebates all year long ? :P
Godz damit. Installer used oem 534's.. mystery likely solved. My 542's must have been a victim of "what are these doing here??"
SP 542S are cheap right now, I think I paid 6 or 7 bucks, I never get more then 20,000 out of my plugs, 12,000 from brake pads and 50,000 from struts or shocks....I am hard on things I guess...
Even Ford says change them frequently.. so 20k it is then. That's at least 1x a year. Guess I will suck it up.
Good news is 542 compared the the ngks I had show I should get a full 20k since I'm not tuned to the hilt due to how the 542 is built different... (yet still a ngk part?)
Imma going to pull the easy plugs and gap the 534's down to .028 anyways and use them up.. then maybe when i feel like a contortionist i will do the last 2 left and right plugs that annoy the crap out of me.. after they wear out i will go back in with 542s... again.
Change the Oil. Its easier than the Spark Plugs. Go with Amsoil since they seem to have the best LSPI package at the moment.
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 09:36:05 PM
Even Ford says change them frequently.. so 20k it is then. That's at least 1x a year. Guess I will suck it up.
Good news is 542 compared the the ngks I had show I should get a full 20k since I'm not tuned to the hilt due to how the 542 is built different... (yet still a ngk part?)
Imma going to pull the easy plugs and gap the 534's down to .028 anyways and use them up.. then maybe when i feel like a contortionist i will do the last 2 left and right plugs that annoy the crap out of me.. after they wear out i will go back in with 542s... again.
The Motorcraft plugs are a re-branded version of the NGK and made by NGK! The SP542 are one step colder than the OEM SP534/580 Spark plugs. Z
Quote from: ZSHO on June 06, 2019, 06:47:53 AM
Quote from: TopherSho on June 05, 2019, 09:36:05 PM
Even Ford says change them frequently.. so 20k it is then. That's at least 1x a year. Guess I will suck it up.
Good news is 542 compared the the ngks I had show I should get a full 20k since I'm not tuned to the hilt due to how the 542 is built different... (yet still a ngk part?)
Imma going to pull the easy plugs and gap the 534's down to .028 anyways and use them up.. then maybe when i feel like a contortionist i will do the last 2 left and right plugs that annoy the crap out of me.. after they wear out i will go back in with 542s... again.
The Motorcraft plugs are a re-branded version of the NGK and made by NGK! The SP542 are one step colder than the OEM SP534/580 Spark plugs. Z
Yes indeed they are but there are "reported" manufacturing differences as read in the f150 forum .. as luck would have it i found one of my spare NGK's (6510) so when i get the 542's and gap them (yup .. took all of 4 hours to decide to just replace them) i will take a gander and post pics
Well I put the 542's in, holy hell do they make a difference .. i have no doubts even without a data log the 2' degrees of lost spark are back and im pushing 26/27 degrees at times.
I gapped a tiny bit under .028.. interesting observation, it is way easier to open them than close them. so on the fronts i closed them down to almost zero, then opened them up to .028.. i will be curious if they 'hold their gap' better by going in deep, changing the metal fatigue in a new direction versus ''gapping them down to .028'' and them opening up.
here are the pics of the plugs.
i found it odd that the 542,s has less in the hole insulator, and have a nipple on the inside of the ground part... the 542 electrode/tip is also more 'exposed' than the ngks...
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/62213187_10156441967737685_4014008630192898048_n.jpg?_nc_cat=103&_nc_oc=AQlCKfq5xlhOUciIkiqWJOUVLU_EDri5oli6ve5K0Rf1H6MJGqh3xzowuwckTI-_cYQ&_nc_ht=scontent-sea1-1.xx&oh=3916f0f501bb25ab3f0f323148139fee&oe=5D8FFF0B)
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/62189699_10156441967887685_8255991547477098496_n.jpg?_nc_cat=108&_nc_oc=AQmeXIPMNkat5aS22AfX4nmX3Sxz5sWW3Mr4jgYpm2DE518ZO1R11I1IHVfp-0ITeuk&_nc_ht=scontent-sea1-1.xx&oh=5966d7db0fc13dda2897b2f2801eeb66&oe=5D5599F8)
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/62002103_10156441968502685_5467625691455422464_o.jpg?_nc_cat=104&_nc_oc=AQmaGfIk41O8Jvq7XslaoTQIGOG2Ji8Z0a0znvXKqTU7zp2N8GzJlAXWKQViDrRnJQE&_nc_ht=scontent-sea1-1.xx&oh=2774ef635bcd964e938b0b7ba8720447&oe=5D9C0185)
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/61921355_10156441968897685_1231740180327563264_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_oc=AQnGOiFZni9TMEoxrp2gfKpeTdc78EQdXMtYyBz4wqwqmkDL1BWy5Y5RxWvRYeYShtY&_nc_ht=scontent-sea1-1.xx&oh=096484710b2d064bdb4fc2237a38745a&oe=5D5593B5)
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/62436665_10156441969077685_3006560597069266944_o.jpg?_nc_cat=104&_nc_oc=AQmVoOgfWqMSotESwm3DQf6sfdiBXw4m66_0owQJzY8WGfs7-05W0unF8aC8WMjG8-M&_nc_ht=scontent-sea1-1.xx&oh=c9df0000d46da50f557704ef98a4c115&oe=5D8DBD25)
Now change your oil and let her eat my friend.
Quote from: SM105K on June 07, 2019, 11:01:40 AM
Now change your oil and let her eat my friend.
For some reason I'm thinking of Gas Monkey. "Let her rip tator chip"
Quote from: 802SHO on June 07, 2019, 11:13:26 AM
Quote from: SM105K on June 07, 2019, 11:01:40 AM
Now change your oil and let her eat my friend.
For some reason I'm thinking of Gas Monkey. "Let her rip tator chip"
My favorite is, "I am the mailman, I just SEND IT!"
Haha when I hang drywall I'll say...Full Send! Send it!
Lol sorry, Topher...just happy for ya!
Quote from: SM105K on June 07, 2019, 11:18:05 AM
Quote from: 802SHO on June 07, 2019, 11:13:26 AM
Quote from: SM105K on June 07, 2019, 11:01:40 AM
Now change your oil and let her eat my friend.
For some reason I'm thinking of Gas Monkey. "Let her rip tator chip"
My favorite is, "I am the mailman, I just SEND IT!"
LOL
Since there is no such thing as a dumb question in this thread, is 0.028" applicable to most tunes/tuners?
My SHO is tuned by Unleashed but I do not have a clue what gap I am supposed to use. Had the car for more than a year now and want to get prepared to change these.
On the other hand, I read you guys complaining about replacing the rear plugs, IMO, this is a piece of cake for a transverse V6.
I had to remove the intake plenum on my Mazda 6 to replace them and once had a Toyota Sienna that I sold with 275k km (170k miles) with the factory plugs on it! since again, a lot had to be removed to change them... I handed 6 brand new plugs to the guy who bought it... "and here you go, 6 brand new spark plugs at no extra cost..." LOL
Quote from: jman on June 07, 2019, 02:09:28 PM
Since there is no such thing as a dumb question in this thread, is 0.028" applicable to most tunes/tuners?
My SHO is tuned by Unleashed but I do not have a clue what gap I am supposed to use. Had the car for more than a year now and want to get prepared to change these.
On the other hand, I read you guys complaining about replacing the rear plugs, IMO, this is a piece of cake for a transverse V6.
I had to remove the intake plenum on my Mazda 6 to replace them and once had a Toyota Sienna that I sold with 275k km (170k miles) with the factory plugs on it! since again, a lot had to be removed to change them... I handed 6 brand new plugs to the guy who bought it... "and here you go, 6 brand new spark plugs at no extra cost..." LOL
Yes its not horrible, still it's just tight...and tight is annoying....well...depends on the subject
We go with "call ups and ship it" all day here at my work.
Quote from: jman on June 07, 2019, 02:09:28 PM
Since there is no such thing as a dumb question in this thread, is 0.028" applicable to most tunes/tuners?
My SHO is tuned by Unleashed but I do not have a clue what gap I am supposed to use. Had the car for more than a year now and want to get prepared to change these.
On the other hand, I read you guys complaining about replacing the rear plugs, IMO, this is a piece of cake for a transverse V6.
I had to remove the intake plenum on my Mazda 6 to replace them and once had a Toyota Sienna that I sold with 275k km (170k miles) with the factory plugs on it! since again, a lot had to be removed to change them... I handed 6 brand new plugs to the guy who bought it... "and here you go, 6 brand new spark plugs at no extra cost..." LOL
I believe Torrie told me .028-.030 back when I ran his tunes.
Quote from: 802SHO on June 07, 2019, 02:15:18 PM
Quote from: jman on June 07, 2019, 02:09:28 PM
Since there is no such thing as a dumb question in this thread, is 0.028" applicable to most tunes/tuners?
My SHO is tuned by Unleashed but I do not have a clue what gap I am supposed to use. Had the car for more than a year now and want to get prepared to change these.
On the other hand, I read you guys complaining about replacing the rear plugs, IMO, this is a piece of cake for a transverse V6.
I had to remove the intake plenum on my Mazda 6 to replace them and once had a Toyota Sienna that I sold with 275k km (170k miles) with the factory plugs on it! since again, a lot had to be removed to change them... I handed 6 brand new plugs to the guy who bought it... "and here you go, 6 brand new spark plugs at no extra cost..." LOL
Yes its not horrible, still it's just tight...and tight is annoying....well...depends on the subject
chika-bow-wow!
Quote from: jman on June 07, 2019, 02:09:28 PM
Since there is no such thing as a dumb question in this thread, is 0.028" applicable to most tunes/tuners?
My SHO is tuned by Unleashed but I do not have a clue what gap I am supposed to use. Had the car for more than a year now and want to get prepared to change these.
On the other hand, I read you guys complaining about replacing the rear plugs, IMO, this is a piece of cake for a transverse V6.
I had to remove the intake plenum on my Mazda 6 to replace them and once had a Toyota Sienna that I sold with 275k km (170k miles) with the factory plugs on it! since again, a lot had to be removed to change them... I handed 6 brand new plugs to the guy who bought it... "and here you go, 6 brand new spark plugs at no extra cost..." LOL
its a double edged sword, smaller gap = hotter spark, for modded cars with increased boost and increased fueling it helps with ignition control and better burn and less knock occurrence. with increased spark control and less knock you will see the tuner increase your base spark or your wot spark limits and increase them.. more spark = more torque... torque is EVERYTHING on this REV limited platform.
but it also means you will burn the tips off your plugs faster as you are decreasing the spark gap and increasing the ARC path temps, so MUCH MUCH shorter lifespan.
in my case my NGK's burned up in less than 15000 miles. or about 5 months time... changed to unmodified 542s and ran them for just under a year .. but lost 2 degrees of spark across the entire rev range.
are they worth it? time will tell if you use them . if you have no issues changing the plugs 2x a year for a DD+racer you will be fine. if like me you have giant hands and are old and annoy easily... there a pita ...
be it my car and my personal experience and opinion. that 2 degrees adds around 20-30ftlbs (on my car with meth) in the medium and low rev range .. its a HUGE difference on my 60' and my 0-100mph.
Closing the loop, switching from Valvoline to a 5-20 BLENDED Castrol more than a week ago. It has made significant difference in third gear spark handing ... could be a new-block still breaking in thing i dunno ... im going to roll with it and just let it be and check in another 5k miles.
edit wrote it wrong .. damn drugs