Mods in signature MINUS the Downpipes....not installed yet. These were done on the same day in a temperature controlled room.
Video of first pull: https://youtu.be/OsPiIaCfK8k
Man, GearHead is putting down down some solid numbers!! Thanks for the comparison!
Very impressive. Roughly 30hp and 20tq at the wheel increase just in a difference of tune. This really shows how powerful a difference in tunes can be. And to think nothing changed as far as your mods/parts to attain that performance increase. Outstanding.
Quote from: 802SHO on February 28, 2019, 06:02:32 AM
Very impressive. Roughly 30hp and 20tq at the wheel increase just in a difference of tune. This really shows how powerful a difference in tunes can be. And to think nothing changed as far as your mods/parts to attain that performance increase. Outstanding.
I would say both tunes are putting down impressive numbers. Traditionally with LMS it normally takes full bolt ons plus meth to even get close to 400 awhp. I was able to do it without Downpipes and using E30. Granted I do have a custom E30 tune from them and the GH intercooler.
They drive very VERY different. The trans tuning and shift points are no where near the same. So it will be interesting to see how they perform at the track. Livernois has ALWAYS surprised me with their times relative to power productions.
My goal is 475awhp and 500awtq.. should put me right at the maximum these cars can take without a motor and trans upgrades.
I was off on TQ, but I pretty much nailed the HP numbers....
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 09:25:50 AM
I was off on TQ, but I pretty much nailed the HP numbers....
Cant remember what your guess was...
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 09:30:35 AM
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 09:25:50 AM
I was off on TQ, but I pretty much nailed the HP numbers....
Cant remember what your guess was...
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,299.msg147040.html#msg147040 (https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,299.msg147040.html#msg147040)
First post on the page. 435/530
Thank you for making this post. Its always interesting when two tunes are compared on a dyno. Its fantastic that you are going compare them at a track too. This is really good information. It IS interesting that Livernois puts up very close track times with proven less power. I know theres a lot of people that would prefer that. But GH isn't a "wreckless" tune either. Its just utilizing everything as it is intended IMHO. Potentially adding 20-30hp and torque at the wheels mind you....for the cost of a tune....is extraordinary!
So this is with the GH IC installed?
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 10:43:25 AM
Quote from: ClearwaterSHO on February 28, 2019, 10:32:33 AM
So this is with the GH IC installed?
Yes it is.
No gains in torque? Your sig says 470 tq before IC and now the dyno shows about the same.
Those aren't my dyno sheets. Those are BJ's. These are his dyno runs showing the difference between the LMS E30 tune and GH E30 tune with having a upgraded HPFP and GH IC.
My car didn't make any more HP or TQ with the GH IC. It made the almost the same, but with less boost. Brad and I seem agree that my turbos are getting tired, and the new intercooler is making them work harder because of how efficient and how much volume it flows. The IC works, I have a boost problem.
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 11:43:30 AM
Those aren't my dyno sheets. Those are BJ's. These are the his dyno runs showing the difference between the LMS E30 tune and GH E30 tune.
My car didn't make any more HP or TQ with the GH IC. It made the almost the same, but with less boost. Brad and I seem agree that my turbos are getting tired, and the new intercooler is making them work harder. The IC works, I have a boost problem.
Makes sense. Can't deny the IC works. I can see it in my logs.
Unfortunately its gonna snow Sunday.. so track runs are gonna have to wait...
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:16:33 PM
Unfortunately its gonna snow Sunday.. so track runs are gonna have to wait...
That's what I am curious about the most. I went to the track last Saturday. I am anxious to compare results.
Quote from: ClearwaterSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:22:30 PM
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:16:33 PM
Unfortunately its gonna snow Sunday.. so track runs are gonna have to wait...
That's what I am curious about the most. I went to the track last Saturday. I am anxious to compare results.
What did you run? What was the DA?
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:23:20 PM
Quote from: ClearwaterSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:22:30 PM
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:16:33 PM
Unfortunately its gonna snow Sunday.. so track runs are gonna have to wait...
That's what I am curious about the most. I went to the track last Saturday. I am anxious to compare results.
What did you run? What was the DA?
I ran a 13.0 DA was 1796 - was 93 Octane tune though.
Looking forward to track results. Gonna be running mine in about 2 weeks, this time I'll make sure I had good fuel, lol.
Quote from: creepmuzik on February 28, 2019, 12:37:31 PM
Looking forward to track results. Gonna be running mine in about 2 weeks, this time I'll make sure I had good fuel, lol.
Well HELLO Ben! I see you have finally made your way to the forums. Welcome! Make sure to post an introduction as well!
I will be headed to the track next Friday so I will be able to report back as well.
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:38:49 PM
Quote from: creepmuzik on February 28, 2019, 12:37:31 PM
Looking forward to track results. Gonna be running mine in about 2 weeks, this time I'll make sure I had good fuel, lol.
Well HELLO Ben! I see you have finally made your way to the forums. Welcome! Make sure to post an introduction as well!
I know right! I've been telling him to join this group. This is where the magic happens! FB only folks don't even know much about the AMAZING AJP.
Quote from: ClearwaterSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:28:22 PM
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:23:20 PM
Quote from: ClearwaterSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:22:30 PM
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:16:33 PM
Unfortunately its gonna snow Sunday.. so track runs are gonna have to wait...
That's what I am curious about the most. I went to the track last Saturday. I am anxious to compare results.
What did you run? What was the DA?
I ran a 13.0 DA was 1796 - was 93 Octane tune though.
I remember you mentioned this before and the DA was almost identical to your 12.5 run correct or is that wrong? 13.0 doesnt sound right. Not with your mods. What's your take on that?
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 11:43:30 AM
Those aren't my dyno sheets. Those are BJ's. These are his dyno runs showing the difference between the LMS E30 tune and GH E30 tune with having a upgraded HPFP and GH IC.
My car didn't make any more HP or TQ with the GH IC. It made the almost the same, but with less boost. Brad and I seem agree that my turbos are getting tired, and the new intercooler is making them work harder because of how efficient and how much volume it flows. The IC works, I have a boost problem.
Sm105k its interesting you say that. I'm at 18psi boost I don't think I will get much benefit with the new IC as I already have meth that gives me cooling and octane. The IC will increase wgdc and my stockers probably will run out of breath...I need more air (ATP) upgrade. Quite frankly we all need everything...its just what do we do next?
Quote from: 802SHO on February 28, 2019, 01:04:44 PM
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 11:43:30 AM
Those aren't my dyno sheets. Those are BJ's. These are his dyno runs showing the difference between the LMS E30 tune and GH E30 tune with having a upgraded HPFP and GH IC.
My car didn't make any more HP or TQ with the GH IC. It made the almost the same, but with less boost. Brad and I seem agree that my turbos are getting tired, and the new intercooler is making them work harder because of how efficient and how much volume it flows. The IC works, I have a boost problem.
Sm105k its interesting you say that. I'm at 18psi boost I don't think I will get much benefit with the new IC as I already have meth that gives me cooling and octane. The IC will increase wgdc and my stockers probably will run out of breath...I need more air (ATP) upgrade. Quite frankly we all need everything...its just what do we do next?
Turbos are next on my list.. I have a quote in hand for Livernois to do it, and a quote in hand for my local speed shop to do it... Just waiting on a few more details...and then shore it up. Being as LMS is so far away from me, its looking like it will be better to install locally.. I am also working with Matt at GH to finalize the quote for his turbo's installed.. At this point, it just aligning up the pieces. Payment is ready.
Your car is going to rip! Lol as if it already doesnt! I'll have my finances in order very soon. I am interested in GH upgraded turbos as well. If I could do it all at once I would do the IC, HPFP, hot pipes and upgraded turbos. That is the end goal. For now turbos and HPFP...or turbos and IC and hot pipes. Once I get turbos I'll quickly run out of fuel...but I can't do it all....and I don't like the idea of more boost and fuel with the stock IC plumbing....so not sure yet. Roughly 4 grand either way.
Quote from: 802SHO on February 28, 2019, 12:55:22 PM
Quote from: ClearwaterSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:28:22 PM
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:23:20 PM
Quote from: ClearwaterSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:22:30 PM
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:16:33 PM
Unfortunately its gonna snow Sunday.. so track runs are gonna have to wait...
That's what I am curious about the most. I went to the track last Saturday. I am anxious to compare results.
What did you run? What was the DA?
I ran a 13.0 DA was 1796 - was 93 Octane tune though.
I remember you mentioned this before and the DA was almost identical to your 12.5 run correct or is that wrong? 13.0 doesnt sound right. Not with your mods. What's your take on that?
It isn't fair to compare the two runs. 12.59 was E30 vs 13.0 on 93. The IC really starts to help out on the back half of the track. I will say that where I saw the issues was that my 60ft were back to what they were stock. I was seeing 1.9-2.1 60ft times. Like the car just wasn't building boost off the line. Logs show it is though, so I don't know. That is a question for Matt or Brad on what was going on. I have a GH tune, I'm going to see what happens with that. Matt mentioned something about the WGDC settings need to be adjusted for the new volume of the intercooler.
Ok. I asked because I would like to think even a potent 93 tune would net you under a 13. Based on the time alone it sounded like something wasnt quite right. Hopefully you get it sorted out. Your E30 tune for sure will beat the 93 tune but 93 should have done better.
Quote from: 802SHO on February 28, 2019, 01:45:57 PM
Ok. I asked because I would like to think even a potent 93 tune would net you under a 13. Based on the time alone it sounded like something wasnt quite right. Hopefully you get it sorted out. Your E30 tune for sure will beat the 93 tune but 93 should have done better.
Yea, I thought so too. I was honestly expecting to be close to what my E30 tune ran before the IC with the 93, but I guess I was over ambitious about it. Won't be able to run the 1/4 again until March 16th. I'll be able to go to the 1/8th mile next Wednesday, but it's going to be cool out and I'm not sure the stock HPFP can keep up with the E30 tune in 40-50 degree weather.
Quote from: 802SHO on February 28, 2019, 01:04:44 PM
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 11:43:30 AM
Those aren't my dyno sheets. Those are BJ's. These are his dyno runs showing the difference between the LMS E30 tune and GH E30 tune with having a upgraded HPFP and GH IC.
My car didn't make any more HP or TQ with the GH IC. It made the almost the same, but with less boost. Brad and I seem agree that my turbos are getting tired, and the new intercooler is making them work harder because of how efficient and how much volume it flows. The IC works, I have a boost problem.
Sm105k its interesting you say that. I'm at 18psi boost I don't think I will get much benefit with the new IC as I already have meth that gives me cooling and octane. The IC will increase wgdc and my stockers probably will run out of breath...I need more air (ATP) upgrade. Quite frankly we all need everything...its just what do we do next?
I am in a the similar boat. I am almost out of fuel and my turbos are tired. I have the IAT's and spark, I just don't have the air and fuel anymore.
The stock intercooler bottlenecks the stock turbos which allowed them to stay at a higher boost level. This new IC is a bit bigger and it has dropped the boost level across the board, because of the increased area and volume.
I could have my stockers rebuilt with a pair of upgraded wheels, or I can get brand new stock turbos off Tasca for like $427 a turbo. However, with new stock turbos, I will be out of fuel completely. So either way, I am spending $3400 minimum (upgraded HPFP, rebuilt with billet wheels or stock turbos, and catless DP's) to achieve the power levels I am seeking.
Quote from: ClearwaterSHO on February 28, 2019, 01:48:09 PM
Quote from: 802SHO on February 28, 2019, 01:45:57 PM
Ok. I asked because I would like to think even a potent 93 tune would net you under a 13. Based on the time alone it sounded like something wasnt quite right. Hopefully you get it sorted out. Your E30 tune for sure will beat the 93 tune but 93 should have done better.
Yea, I thought so too. I was honestly expecting to be close to what my E30 tune ran before the IC with the 93, but I guess I was over ambitious about it. Won't be able to run the 1/4 again until March 16th. I'll be able to go to the 1/8th mile next Wednesday, but it's going to be cool out and I'm not sure the stock HPFP can keep up with the E30 tune in 40-50 degree weather.
You should be stable with the fuel pressure in 40-50 degree weather. I was with a little more wiggle room.
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 01:58:03 PM
Quote from: ClearwaterSHO on February 28, 2019, 01:48:09 PM
Quote from: 802SHO on February 28, 2019, 01:45:57 PM
Ok. I asked because I would like to think even a potent 93 tune would net you under a 13. Based on the time alone it sounded like something wasnt quite right. Hopefully you get it sorted out. Your E30 tune for sure will beat the 93 tune but 93 should have done better.
Yea, I thought so too. I was honestly expecting to be close to what my E30 tune ran before the IC with the 93, but I guess I was over ambitious about it. Won't be able to run the 1/4 again until March 16th. I'll be able to go to the 1/8th mile next Wednesday, but it's going to be cool out and I'm not sure the stock HPFP can keep up with the E30 tune in 40-50 degree weather.
You should be stable with the fuel pressure in 40-50 degree weather. I was with a little more wiggle room.
Depends on the tune and the car...
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:38:49 PM
Quote from: creepmuzik on February 28, 2019, 12:37:31 PM
Looking forward to track results. Gonna be running mine in about 2 weeks, this time I'll make sure I had good fuel, lol.
Well HELLO Ben! I see you have finally made your way to the forums. Welcome! Make sure to post an introduction as well!
Hey guys, lol. I've actually been a member for about 2 years. Just pop in for research mostly. Where do I do an intro post at?
Quote from: creepmuzik on February 28, 2019, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:38:49 PM
Quote from: creepmuzik on February 28, 2019, 12:37:31 PM
Looking forward to track results. Gonna be running mine in about 2 weeks, this time I'll make sure I had good fuel, lol.
Well HELLO Ben! I see you have finally made your way to the forums. Welcome! Make sure to post an introduction as well!
Hey guys, lol. I've actually been a member for about 2 years. Just pop in for research mostly. Where do I do an intro post at?
New Member Introductions on the forum page at the top.
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 01:59:23 PM
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 01:58:03 PM
Quote from: ClearwaterSHO on February 28, 2019, 01:48:09 PM
Quote from: 802SHO on February 28, 2019, 01:45:57 PM
Ok. I asked because I would like to think even a potent 93 tune would net you under a 13. Based on the time alone it sounded like something wasnt quite right. Hopefully you get it sorted out. Your E30 tune for sure will beat the 93 tune but 93 should have done better.
Yea, I thought so too. I was honestly expecting to be close to what my E30 tune ran before the IC with the 93, but I guess I was over ambitious about it. Won't be able to run the 1/4 again until March 16th. I'll be able to go to the 1/8th mile next Wednesday, but it's going to be cool out and I'm not sure the stock HPFP can keep up with the E30 tune in 40-50 degree weather.
You should be stable with the fuel pressure in 40-50 degree weather. I was with a little more wiggle room.
Depends on the tune and the car...
Well, I did some logging last night and I was at 2k on the Fuel Pressure. I'm not great at reading logs, so I'm not sure what other fuel pressure numbers you need to look at.
Yes all cars are different. I digress, mine is stable yours might not be.
Quote from: creepmuzik on February 28, 2019, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 12:38:49 PM
Quote from: creepmuzik on February 28, 2019, 12:37:31 PM
Looking forward to track results. Gonna be running mine in about 2 weeks, this time I'll make sure I had good fuel, lol.
Well HELLO Ben! I see you have finally made your way to the forums. Welcome! Make sure to post an introduction as well!
Hey guys, lol. I've actually been a member for about 2 years. Just pop in for research mostly. Where do I do an intro post at?
Welcome Creepmuzik! INTRO is on the below link. Z :)
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/board,14.0.html (https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/board,14.0.html)
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 11:43:30 AM
My car didn't make any more HP or TQ with the GH IC. It made the almost the same, but with less boost. Brad and I seem agree that my turbos are getting tired, and the new intercooler is making them work harder because of how efficient and how much volume it flows. The IC works, I have a boost problem.
I'm assuming the ATP turbo upgrade would do it, but...would upgrading the impellers be enough?
I think a compressor/impeller upgrade may be on the horizon. I can't be completely rule them out.
Quote from: 4sfed on February 28, 2019, 03:32:55 PM
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 11:43:30 AM
My car didn't make any more HP or TQ with the GH IC. It made the almost the same, but with less boost. Brad and I seem agree that my turbos are getting tired, and the new intercooler is making them work harder because of how efficient and how much volume it flows. The IC works, I have a boost problem.
I'm assuming the ATP turbo upgrade would do it, but...would upgrading the impellers be enough?
So, ATPs are nice, but the wastegate it comes with is not correct for our application from what I understand. I know one guy who had to make some major adjustments to get it right, and he still isn't happy with it. The only people who don't have those issues are the LMS installed ATPs. They order them with a different wastegate setup, however, they won't tell me which wastegate they order them with.
EDIT: They don't order them from ATP with any different setup, as I just spoke with ATP 2 minutes ago. They only offer them one way. So whatever adjustments are made, happens after they ship by Livernois.
And let me guess the only way to get them is an in house install? What about GH turbos? Are they ready for sale yet?
Quote from: 802SHO on February 28, 2019, 05:42:09 PM
And let me guess the only way to get them is an in house install? What about GH turbos? Are they ready for sale yet?
No, not yet..I'm working on getting my shop to get a quote for them from Gearhead. If we can make the time line work, then the shop will add some margin to it, but then the turbos and labor will be under warranty.
In short... I have a quote from LMS and working a Gearhead quote...
Quote from: BJSHO on February 28, 2019, 05:10:37 PM
Quote from: 4sfed on February 28, 2019, 03:32:55 PM
Quote from: sm105k on February 28, 2019, 11:43:30 AM
My car didn't make any more HP or TQ with the GH IC. It made the almost the same, but with less boost. Brad and I seem agree that my turbos are getting tired, and the new intercooler is making them work harder because of how efficient and how much volume it flows. The IC works, I have a boost problem.
I'm assuming the ATP turbo upgrade would do it, but...would upgrading the impellers be enough?
So, ATPs are nice, but the wastegate it comes with is not correct for our application from what I understand. I know one guy who had to make some major adjustments to get it right, and he still isn't happy with it. The only people who don't have those issues are the LMS installed ATPs. They order them with a different wastegate setup, however, they won't tell me which wastegate they order them with.
EDIT: They don't order them from ATP with any different setup, as I just spoke with ATP 2 minutes ago. They only offer them one way. So whatever adjustments are made, happens after they ship by Livernois.
To be fair he was having crazy wastegates issues to his stock turbos before the ATP turbos upgrade as well.
Updated dyno graph with LMS best vs GH best.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190314/5fe3f62966d80f819b0900e230e49cfb.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Its nice to see the comparisons on the same graph...it looks like Livernois was your stock file and GH when you are tuned...its that much of a difference between the two tunes. I think that's very interesting and again shows how much can either be left on the table or as much as possible utilized from the same recipe of parts with the only exception being the tune. Cool stuff. And Livernois is very potent and safe so no discredit to them. These are both great companies.
I'm assuming you will be doing another dyno comparison when you upgrade your SHO further in late April?
Quote from: 802SHO on March 15, 2019, 05:58:05 AM
Its nice to see the comparisons on the same graph...it looks like Livernois was your stock file and GH when you are tuned...its that much of a difference between the two tunes. I think that's very interesting and again shows how much can either be left on the table or as much as possible utilized from the same recipe of parts with the only exception being the tune. Cool stuff. And Livernois is very potent and safe so no discredit to them. These are both great companies.
I'm assuming you will be doing another dyno comparison when you upgrade your SHO further in late April?
No, I would need to schedule time to drive to LMS for a custom tune. After the turbos and downpipes it will be GH tuned for the foreseeable future unless I want to drive to LMS for a tune.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Gotcha. I forgot LMS tunes turbo upgrade setups in house only and not via email tune support like you had for the HPFP E30 tune.