Well i hate the way the factory setup sounds (Sony W/ Nav)
Id like to upgrade to something a little better and have a few questions:
First, Im reading that swapping out to another DSP will remove all the neat Sync features that my wife loves and would murder me if i removed. Plus im seeing you lose factory volume control. is there any way around this?
Second, if there's no way around having to lose sync, i guess ill just look toward upgrading the $1.95 "premium" Sony Speakers.
My thoughts are to swap out the doors with something better. no need to go crazy since id be at the mercy of the factory amp/dsp. something like some jbl GT7s. (if i can power them id swap this for some hertz/morels)
leave the factory center channels and tweeters alone. they seem to be ok.
either remove the "subwoofer" 6x9s the rear deck has so the subs can breath or swap them out to something less rattley and boomy that would help with mids. maybe a matching jbl GT series.
a couple soundqubed 12s in a ported box and a matching amp in the trunk and a lc2i later and hopefully i can be happier with it.
right?
Thoughts? Concerns? tips? pictures of tacos?
you will not lose volume control using a dsp if you get your signal after the factory amp maybe you will lose option of sync giving you the wierd sound surround sound but the dsp can do that too with tweaking if it has audio delay/timing
there is another user on here that did that using a http://www.audiocontrol.com/car-audio/digital-signal-processors/dm-810/ (http://www.audiocontrol.com/car-audio/digital-signal-processors/dm-810/)
its what id use also to get the most outputs for such a cheap price compared to audison
this dsp will get you active crossovers so you dont lose power using passive they lose alot converting turned into heat and better control of db levels of matching each speaker output.
hmm so if i pickup a single from post DSP/AMP ill be ok? i dont care about losing the sync surround stuff but dont wanna lose bluetooth and volume control.
anyone here using the jl fix stuff? self calibrate sounds nice
I'm using a jbl ms-8 and I'm still retaining all sync functions.
The key is getting the full range signal AFTER the amp.
All sync functions are processed in the amp/acm.
You can now get rid of the factory amp and keep all factory features. Axxess has a new interface out called AX-DSP. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eD80LaT2jKY
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Quote from: B198301 on February 22, 2017, 09:47:41 PM
You can now get rid of the factory amp and keep all factory features. Axxess has a new interface out called AX-DSP. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eD80LaT2jKY
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I will definitely look into that more for a little more oomph
RF has a new DSP coming out in the spring that should work as well. I also I have to find where I saw info about changing things in forscan to make the outputs from the deck include the sync audio and variable output. They are from the factory fixed output and the Sony amp will change volume. Its supposedly and makes sense to me much cleaner this way.
http://www.2gfusions.net/showthread.php?tid=3704
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So I am no looking at an upgrade to my Sony/nav system in my '13 SHO. Looking for some more punch and warmth to the sound. The system just does not have a full bodied richer sound, it is a bit tiny, and boosting mid/low on the head unit does not help.
I read on another ford forum (taurus/fusion/focus?) that people saw a notable improvement just replacing the speakers themselves and nothing else. Has anyone tried this?
Researching shows we have 6x8's in the doors and that there are adapter plates that make it so you can mount 6.5's in those stock location has anyone done that?
I thougt BPD had a big audio install thread that might help, but I cannot find it and his was a super custom install so likely not using stock locations?
A MASSIVE install, literally :D But I don't think a thread was setup on EBPF. He did have it at Carlisle and it did very well.
I did have a MASSIVE one-off, custom audio upgrade done this past spring.
Those who saw/heard it 1st hand while attending the 2017 Ford National's will attest to it's performance therein.
However, due to recent Photobucket changes that prevent 3rd party hosting (at least until I decide IF I want to flip for their $400 recurring, annual fee) the images are in limbo at the moment.
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You may get better quality but it will never be louder. You would have to have aftermarket amps for it to be louder/pound. Putting in an adjustable subwoofer will suffice for most people.
Quality first, volume second :) It took a while for bpd's build to come together because he wanted both to be first :)
Yeah I am not really looking for more volume, just more depth and quality to the sound. What I am reading is pointing me to installing 6.5" 2 or 3 way units to replace the stock 6x8. Though some people on taurus forum say even replacing the stockers with midrange 6x8's nets a marked improvement. Then maybe I install a 10" sub if I still need more punch.
Def not wanting to cut the car up, looking for drop in replacement in stock aside from the 10" in an enclosure..
I have 6.5s up front but have custom mounts replacing the factory plastic 6x8 mount. I'm sure you can do it with just adapters. I can't comment on improvement of just speakers because I had a full system done all at once.
So I noticed something this morning in regards to audio quality.
"FM" - sounds meh no real definition, just muddy with not much punch.
"FM HD" - sounds better, best sound of all formats actually, noticeably more punch though still a bit muddy in midranges.
XM Radio - Worst of all of them, totally tinny sounding, almost has a hiss to it like you are listening over VHS radio like on a boat.
Just thought I would share. The HD definitely had a much better sound to it which makes me wonder if part of it is signalling as much as radio/speakers. I need to get a known good DVD and try it in the car next, and USB drive stick as well.
XM/Sirius are less than 128kbs so crappy compressed sound.
HD Radio is compressed but not as badly so HD radio should sound better.
XM uses an audio codec known as HE-AAC, or aacPlus v1. It's designed to deliver higher quality audio at bitrates lower than 96 kbps (192 kbps MP3). Sirius uses a less efficient codec called ePAC, which takes more data to deliver at the same quality as HE-AAC. XM also uses the AMBE codec for its voice only data channels, aka the robot voice channels, which uses a mere 4 kbps.
Yup both signal and equipment play into what you ultimately hear, along with the "shape" of the listening room. Focusing on equipment, while they may state they accommodate multiple sound formats, usually there is a "native" format, one they are really good at, the rest is good or merely acceptable for compatibility purposes. Just like HDTV. Most really are not that great with non-HD video. I am sure a modder could easily elevate the performance of audio equipment in vehicles, there are SO many weak points in the chain from incoming signal to outgoing sound. The compactness of things poses a real challenge.
Yeah input quality definitely matters. I was just a bit surprised that the formats were quite so different. Hate std radio with commercials, but Sat quality so tiny that not enjoyable either... Gotta get that USB stick all setup! then swap out speakers.
Just read this over on Taurus forum. It is from 2013, but pretty telling about why so many find the top tier Sony system so lacking..
Quote from: 2011TAURUSSELAlso I am just a lowly SEL person so I can't speak for the rear deck but the Kenwoods in the Doors made a world of difference in the sound over OEM Also make note that the same part numbers show for all door speakers whether it is the regular, middle or SONY sound system. It also goes to show that no matter what the sound system is if the sound is being pushed through $7.00 speakers then thats what the sound will be like.
Only so much joy through equalization :)
Quote from: SHOdded on July 25, 2017, 03:37:06 PM
Only so much joy through equalization :)
A system is only as good as it's weakest part. The Sony head unit and EQ could be phenominal, (they are probably pretty good and better than stock system) bet when you feed that nice clean signal to a pair of crap speakers you lose all that performance and end up with a wet noodle sound system.
My debate right now is a bunch of 6x8's or adapters and go 6.5's which should sound even better and probably provide better mid/low punch and clarity.
Funny part is all the differing info I see on the web about the Taurus. 5x7 or 6x8 in doors (same mount from what I am finding so not that important), 6x8 or 6x9 rear deck. I am going to pull a door panel and maybe rear deck off sometime soon and get some actual measurements myself before I buy replacements.
No substitute for measuring yourself :) However, you may find similar discussions on shoforum helpful?
https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/replace-stock-speakers.134907/ (https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/replace-stock-speakers.134907/)
https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/6x9-rear-deck-subs.134957/ (https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/6x9-rear-deck-subs.134957/)
https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/speaker-info-install-needed.131785/ (https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/speaker-info-install-needed.131785/)
https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/gen-4-speaker-upgrade-stock-size.130838/ (https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/gen-4-speaker-upgrade-stock-size.130838/)
And of course there are Lanson's builds for his 2 Flex's that may help also.
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,725 (https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,725)
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,2574 (https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,2574)
Well I finally started the upgrade. I have had all the parts sitting here for a month and just no time to do eet! I am starting with the door speakers out of the gate and will see how it goes.
VEHICLE: 2013 SHO PP
I am converting to more std 6.5" round speakers both for wide selection of speakers and better sound. This is a prelim post, I only have one speaker installed so far, but it was simple bolt in so I wanted to very to folks that 6.5" do fit. All the various thread seem to have back and forth, one person says they fit, another they do not. I can tell you with certainty that 6.5" round speakers fit in the front doors with the listed adapter rings.
You will need:
- 6.5" Speakers
- Speaker mount adapters
- wiring adapters
- 9/32" socket
- 6.5mm socket (I used 1/4")
- 8mm socket
- 10mm socket
- Panel removal tool
- Phillips head screwdriver
- whatever screw driver/wrench needed for screws included in your speaker package.
- tape
- seal pick is handy
I went with:
- Pioneer TS-A1675S (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00A0LZHYS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1) X2
- Metra 72-5600 Ford Speaker Harness 1998-UP (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001OAB6BW/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1) X2
- Scosche SA68 Convertible 6x8-Inch Speaker Adapter - Pair (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0007TJDFM/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) X2
Total $126.68.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170825/fcbb231e8467709f9fc63cba7c9fbcc0.jpg)
For a quick tutorial I watched this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYwMB-1PLoc). One important note is that he says two phillips along bottom (was on a 2010), My 2013 had two 9/32" bolts. PLEASE NOTE: resist temptation of hangning the panel from the door release cable. I though it would just be a moment, but now my door release is no longer smooth and I think I kinked the cable.
Once you have door off old speaker just unscrews using the 1/4" or 6.5mm socket. Ope the adapter mount package and open your speaker package. Your speakers should come with folded blind nuts as shown.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170825/98ae237cf025e6c42b9a66f69818fd9b.jpg)
Lay the speaker in the mount and note were the holes line up. Take your blind nuts and tape them in place on the mount where they will be used. I did this because my speakers covered the 4 bolt locations to install the mount to the door. so I had to install mount into door, then speaker into mount.
Old and new speaker plus install parts. You can see the blind nuts taped in place.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170825/481760816fe5cd8f8e004ab37f588032.jpg)
I will wrap this up tomorrow night when I get the second set installed.... stay tuned!
How did your Metra adapters work out? They were a terrible fit for my Edge, 3 out of 4 I had to trim about 2mm off the plug to fit into the OEM harness. ugly solution but it worked, otherwise it would not latch on.
Only have one speaker installed, but it plugged right in for me with no issue. I will be completing the install tonight and post again with rest of install.
Quote from: bpd1151 on July 21, 2017, 07:52:36 PM
I did have a MASSIVE one-off, custom audio upgrade done this past spring.
Those who saw/heard it 1st hand while attending the 2017 Ford National's will attest to it's performance therein.
However, due to recent Photobucket changes that prevent 3rd party hosting (at least until I decide IF I want to flip for their $400 recurring, annual fee) the images are in limbo at the moment.
Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
I did an upgrade not nearly as uh over the top of some rich people here, but substantial nonetheless.
While the factory setup works, if want AWESOME sound you should go aftermarket. I believe Metra still makes a kit that fits SHO with/without NAV.
http://www.metraonline.com/part/99-5722 (http://www.metraonline.com/part/99-5722)
Or if you can find the discontinued Scosche model.
https://www.amazon.com/Scosche-FD1447B-2010-Up-Taurus-Double/dp/B0057RIQWU (https://www.amazon.com/Scosche-FD1447B-2010-Up-Taurus-Double/dp/B0057RIQWU)
Additional note to self (and anyone reading).
Make sure to get the door lock indicator up thru the panel before/as you re-instal the door panel.
Mine is inside the door someplace so the door does not want to open. Fun game of whak-a-mole trying to get into car. Have to time as hit unlock button and catch the mechanism before to rebounds back to locked position and disconnects the door handle... :judge:
:(
Promised a follow up..
Speakers have been in for just over 2 months now. Install was so simple I didn't think it made sense to do a full write up. Hardest part is door panel removal which is covered in a bunch of youtube videos better than I could ever explain it. After that it is literally plug and play with the parts I listed.
One note/recommendation. use a piece of clear scotch tape to tape each of the metal clips in place on the adapter. Otherwise they fall out, repeatedly, and every time you look at them, and then again when you breath.. Ask me how I know.
Sound overall was/is much improved. Tighter is best way I can describe it. Sirius and HD radio both still are tiny. Cancelled Sirius lastnight, love the channels, but audio just bad and I am not going to pay monthly for poor audio. I will post new thread about mp3 here shortly. Long and short, my known good MP3's sound pretty darn good with the current setup and looking to build library on usb stick and just run that and/or stream from phone.
Having the Dual USB drives is awesome. All I do is random my thumb drives.
Nice write up lamrith.
Those upgrading speakers might want to add some sound deadening while you are in there and I have had great results with using foam to seal the door panel around the speaker so all the air movement is directed out the speaker grill and not caught in the door panel causing rattles/vibration. They sell FAST rings which re open cell foam so air can still pass through but using weather stripping close cell foam from the hardware store/home depot is typically cheaper and works better.
I'll make another thread on my system and challenges with upgrading to a DSP and aftermarket amps and speakers. After months and a few changes I am finally happy even if it not fully finished.