Hey guys, wanted to update on something I've been working on with Brandon and Mark from Deatschwerks. A few months ago, I started hearing word of an LPFP in the works for the 10-19 Taurus SHO. Many of you know I run the XDI35 HPFP with stock remaining system on E74, and start seeing fuel starvation issues up in the top of the powerband. Since I have worked with Mark in the past, I reached out to him regarding the pump, and he put me in touch with Brandon at R&D.
I know of a few people running the DW300C on the 10-12 cars and it is advertised as a drop in unit, but I couldn't find much data for the 13+ cars, so we used @Jordan_R as a guinea pig to see how the pump worked. The pump had horrible fitment issues, the electrical connector was completely different, and Jordan ended up actually breaking the discharge snout on the pump trying to get it together.
A quick call up to Brandon found that there are actual physical differences between the two pump modules, so I bought an OEM 2013+ fuel pump module and sent it with them. They've had the module for about a week now, and called today to let me know they've modified the kit to be 13+ SHO Specific and it will be drop in, but will require splicing of the electrical connector since as far as we can tell the OE fuel pump electrical connector is proprietary, as my Ford rep and I spent close to 2 hours in the Motorcraft connector pigtail catalog trying to find a match.
They are pulling it back apart to develop an install guide, and then they plan to get flow data before sending it back to me.
All-in-all, I'm excited to bring this to market, and will be adding it to our site for purchase as soon as we get it back.
Most excellent as Bill and Ted would exclaim.
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If you can turn a wrench, you can splice a wire or two. And if you can dodge a wrench, well...
Does this look anything like the LPFP connector or is this the HPFP connector?
MOTORCRAFT WPT521 {3U2Z14S411TZA}
Leads: 8; Color: Grey; Gender: Female (Only 1 Remaining)
Another option is to look on digikey or mouser, if Ford does not actually have a replacement for you.
Or is it the connector directly on the LPFP such as this might be
8U2Z-14S411-NA
Wire Assy
5 Cavity , Fuel Pump/Sending Unit , Pumps And Motors
Base Number: 14S411A
Callout Name: 14S411A
$41.93$26.29
2013 SHO LPFP, Fuel Level Sensor, Fuel Pressure Sensor, and Fuel Pump Control Module wiring diagrams with connectors
2012 SHO Fuel Pump, Fuel Level Sensor, Fuel Pump Control Module Connector
Sooo quick heads up...
Matt Robinson at Gearhead worked with DW earlier this year on this pump. I have flow numbers he sent me awhile ago...
I just confirmed with him that the pump does drop into his 2016 SHO and he just needed to pig tail the connector. Not a big deal.
Now if Lee is working with them to send a pre built harness that would be ideal too.
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(https://i.imgur.com/1ANQJTu_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium)
This is the lpfp connector. I bought the pump through lee but had fitment issues that's why he got with them on making more changes
A direct plug and play would be nice.
Quote from: SM105K on November 12, 2019, 11:29:30 AM
A direct plug and play would be nice.
Under purchase that was my expectation and what I had been told. Unfortunately not the case at that time
I guess they figured you could take it off your cpu cooling fan lol
Quote from: StealBlueSHO on November 12, 2019, 08:33:17 AM
Sooo quick heads up...
Matt Robinson at Gearhead worked with DW earlier this year on this pump. I have flow numbers he sent me awhile ago...
I just confirmed with him that the pump does drop into his 2016 SHO and he just needed to pig tail the connector. Not a big deal.
Now if Lee is working with them to send a pre built harness that would be ideal too.
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Yea that's how I originally got the idea based on his data. I bought a pump for myself and Jordan bought one too. He went to install his first, and it didn't fit under any circumstances. Don't know what happened, the tech that built Matt's doesn't work for them anymore so something changed, and I didn't want others to run into the same issue. I heard Costigan is running one too and had to make extensive modifications for it to work.
Quote from: SHOdded on November 12, 2019, 02:00:36 AM
Does this look anything like the LPFP connector or is this the HPFP connector?
MOTORCRAFT WPT521 {3U2Z14S411TZA}
Leads: 8; Color: Grey; Gender: Female (Only 1 Remaining)
Another option is to look on digikey or mouser, if Ford does not actually have a replacement for you.
This is the comparison between the OEM harness and the DW pump.
I don't see what the problem could be. LOL
Just jam it in there and SEND IT!!!!
Me either. Looks like it will fit my 2010 just fine....give it here
Yea, Matt said the project got dropped when the guy he was working with left. He originally told me it was a drop in replacement. I do remember him telling me there was a connector that needed to be pig tailed but otherwise was drop in.
Mine has been sitting in the garage for awhile... looks like I will just wait for the harness before I build one.. lol..
Quote from: StealBlueSHO on November 13, 2019, 08:41:49 AM
Yea, Matt said the project got dropped when the guy he was working with left. He originally told me it was a drop in replacement. I do remember him telling me there was a connector that needed to be pig tailed but otherwise was drop in.
Mine has been sitting in the garage for awhile... looks like I will just wait for the harness before I build one.. lol..
Brandon told me that anyone who has bought one with the install kit can contact DW and they will send out a replacement install kit with the correct bracket and pigtail.
Quote from: FiveLeeter918 on November 13, 2019, 11:43:19 AM
Quote from: StealBlueSHO on November 13, 2019, 08:41:49 AM
Yea, Matt said the project got dropped when the guy he was working with left. He originally told me it was a drop in replacement. I do remember him telling me there was a connector that needed to be pig tailed but otherwise was drop in.
Mine has been sitting in the garage for awhile... looks like I will just wait for the harness before I build one.. lol..
Brandon told me that anyone who has bought one with the install kit can contact DW and they will send out a replacement install kit with the correct bracket and pigtail.
Thanks for the heads up! Just got off the phone with Brandon. They are shipping me out the adapter/pigtail today. Makes life easier for sure. Thanks for your help with this.
Can we get a link to the DW pump?
Quote from: SM105K on November 13, 2019, 12:59:09 PM
Can we get a link to the DW pump?
https://www.deatschwerks.com/9-307-1026 (https://www.deatschwerks.com/9-307-1026)
So thats the link... the part is technically the 9-307 and the 1026 is the install kit. Brandon said the install kit should have a part number within the next couple weeks. However, if you call them you can order the pump with the correct kit today.
Selfish plug :-P
https://www.ortizperformance.com/product-page/deatschwerks-dw300c-2013-2019-taurus-sho-flex-mks (https://www.ortizperformance.com/product-page/deatschwerks-dw300c-2013-2019-taurus-sho-flex-mks)
Quote from: FiveLeeter918 on November 13, 2019, 02:27:39 PM
Selfish plug :-P
https://www.ortizperformance.com/product-page/deatschwerks-dw300c-2013-2019-taurus-sho-flex-mks (https://www.ortizperformance.com/product-page/deatschwerks-dw300c-2013-2019-taurus-sho-flex-mks)
Lee, when you confirm that it is the correct plug and play can you let us know? I will purchase it from you guys. I like to spread my money around.
Quote from: FiveLeeter918 on November 13, 2019, 02:27:39 PM
Selfish plug :-P
https://www.ortizperformance.com/product-page/deatschwerks-dw300c-2013-2019-taurus-sho-flex-mks (https://www.ortizperformance.com/product-page/deatschwerks-dw300c-2013-2019-taurus-sho-flex-mks)
lmao...
Will do!
Btw, received the flow comparison data today
(https://shoforum.com/index.php?attachments/dw-vs-stock-flow-sho-lpfp-jpg.10820/)
Matt at Gearhead Automotive Performance flow testing on the same pump from May of this year when he was working with Deatschwerks originally with this pump.. curious if there have been any improvements..
Yea we were comparing the graphs earlier, his was tested at a higher amperage so not 100% an apples to oranges comparison.
I was also surprised that ours shows such an improvement over stock wheres Matt's gains were marginal.
Quote from: FiveLeeter918 on November 14, 2019, 10:09:18 PM
Yea we were comparing the graphs earlier, his was tested at a higher amperage so not 100% an apples to oranges comparison.
I was also surprised that ours shows such an improvement over stock wheres Matt's gains were marginal.
Interesting for sure considering its the same model number pump that was tested etc...
Unfortunately since we don't know the exact test procedures and they were tested by two different techs there isn't much that can be concluded in comparing the two graphs. Other than the 300C flows more.. ha! Did both setups use new socks? Was one possibly clogged? Did they use the same bucket or was one tested in the bucket vs one tested outside the bucket.. too many unknowns..
But at least we do have a potential LPFP solution.. Matt Robinson is currently running this pump in his 2016 SHO today. According to him there doesn't need to be any changes to the tune to take advantage of the new pump however, there is always optimizing that can be done.
As soon as I get the adapter kit I will probably install mine.. unless its too bloody cold.. my current setup is running fine so I may wait until spring time... dunno..
Received the new adapter kit...
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191115/021529b49abe7a7899a691a5f9b50f6d.jpg)
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(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191117/17b1e91025c62350b22aaefd32c6177a.jpg)
Highly recommend using this or similar to get the fuel lock ring off. I have done it without using a lock ring tool but it sure makes it easier.
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you guys cost me too much money.
Quote from: StealBlueSHO on November 17, 2019, 08:51:31 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191117/17b1e91025c62350b22aaefd32c6177a.jpg)
Highly recommend using this or similar to get the fuel lock ring off. I have done it without using a lock ring tool but it sure makes it easier.
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flat head wedged between and twist and it popped right off for me. Pliers to squeeze back on also worked like a charm.
Quote from: Jordan on November 17, 2019, 05:20:54 PM
Quote from: StealBlueSHO on November 17, 2019, 08:51:31 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191117/17b1e91025c62350b22aaefd32c6177a.jpg)
Highly recommend using this or similar to get the fuel lock ring off. I have done it without using a lock ring tool but it sure makes it easier.
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flat head wedged between and twist and it popped right off for me. Pliers to squeeze back on also worked like a charm.
Yup. My 2010 was tight... ended up needing a hammer to help lol...
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Final updates from Deatschwerks today.
Nice. Plug your phone in Lee!
Realized it only attached the second shot
Would this pump be worth it if your still running the factory HPFP?
Probably not, the lpfp flows more than enough to satisfy the HPFP even on E30.
Did the drop in replacement ever occur? I saw heavy modification as the last update with the mention of future correction?
Quote from: StealBlueSHO on November 17, 2019, 08:51:31 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191117/17b1e91025c62350b22aaefd32c6177a.jpg)
Highly recommend using this or similar to get the fuel lock ring off. I have done it without using a lock ring tool but it sure makes it easier.
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That tool makes it a breeze and it fits several makes and models. I can't tell you how many of those things I took off/on for the fuel pump tank module recall a few years back not to mention all the other cars we've pulled the tank module out of. Some are easy, some not so much, but that "style" (doesn't have to be OTC brand) and a long handle 1/2" drive ratchet is fool proof.
If someone gets a chance while switching to the DW300C pump, I'd be interested in seeing a picture of the factory pump set up and then with the DW pump installed just to see what has to be done to make it fit the tank unit.
Quote from: StinkinLinkin13 on January 30, 2020, 01:51:55 PM
Did the drop in replacement ever occur? I saw heavy modification as the last update with the mention of future correction?
You have to modify the OEM housing to get it to fit. I sent mine and a new assembly to DW and they installed it for me. Car has it installed now and running great.
Great to hear Jordan.
Nice to see some resulting data from it's implementation.
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Quote from: 6500rpm on January 30, 2020, 05:16:07 PM
Quote from: StealBlueSHO on November 17, 2019, 08:51:31 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191117/17b1e91025c62350b22aaefd32c6177a.jpg)
Highly recommend using this or similar to get the fuel lock ring off. I have done it without using a lock ring tool but it sure makes it easier.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
That tool makes it a breeze and it fits several makes and models. I can't tell you how many of those things I took off/on for the fuel pump tank module recall a few years back not to mention all the other cars we've pulled the tank module out of. Some are easy, some not so much, but that "style" (doesn't have to be OTC brand) and a long handle 1/2" drive ratchet is fool proof.
If someone gets a chance while switching to the DW300C pump, I'd be interested in seeing a picture of the factory pump set up and then with the DW pump installed just to see what has to be done to make it fit the tank unit.
You just have to bore out the cradle housing as there is a lip that causes problems... clean it up and it slides in.
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Quote from: StealBlueSHO on January 31, 2020, 02:35:37 PM
Quote from: 6500rpm on January 30, 2020, 05:16:07 PM
Quote from: StealBlueSHO on November 17, 2019, 08:51:31 AM
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191117/17b1e91025c62350b22aaefd32c6177a.jpg)
Highly recommend using this or similar to get the fuel lock ring off. I have done it without using a lock ring tool but it sure makes it easier.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
That tool makes it a breeze and it fits several makes and models. I can't tell you how many of those things I took off/on for the fuel pump tank module recall a few years back not to mention all the other cars we've pulled the tank module out of. Some are easy, some not so much, but that "style" (doesn't have to be OTC brand) and a long handle 1/2" drive ratchet is fool proof.
If someone gets a chance while switching to the DW300C pump, I'd be interested in seeing a picture of the factory pump set up and then with the DW pump installed just to see what has to be done to make it fit the tank unit.
You just have to bore out the cradle housing as there is a lip that causes problems... clean it up and it slides in.
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That's what you think via the instructions, but my pump wouldn't even fit the stock housing sock and clip. Other than just the housing needing modified for it to slip in and the bottom sock filter and clip not fitting there was one thing that just tilted me to the point of sending everything to them. No clue what they did to modify it to fit but those instructions were about the farthest thing from close. Hopefully they get all that sorted because it's keeping up great otherwise
(https://i.imgur.com/Tjcr0gY.jpg)
Thought I'd throw my data that DW added when they tested a brand new OEM compared to their brand new pump
It's pretty crazy that this is the best that can be done after all this time. It must simply just not be very profitable to make a simple drop in plug in play lpfp. I remember you used to be able to find higher flowing fuel pumps easily for about anything 10- 15 years ago. All to gain about 10 hp. 😂. Now there is way more hp left on the table and no no drop in lpfp upgrades.
Quote from: StinkinLinkin13 on January 31, 2020, 09:01:27 PM
It's pretty crazy that this is the best that can be done after all this time. It must simply just not be very profitable to make a simple drop in plug in play lpfp. I remember you used to be able to find higher flowing fuel pumps easily for about anything 10- 15 years ago. All to gain about 10 hp. 😂. Now there is way more hp left on the table and no no drop in lpfp upgrades.
Problem is they have to play nice with the PCM's why we couldn't just throw in a walbro into the car and honestly no clue on how they make money on these things. They definitely didn't make money on mine after the free installation and shipping it back on their cost.
So I've got an XDI HPFP-60 along with their upgraded +50% injectors. I'm still running stock LPFP pump because I was trying to figure a solution that might feed more than the 300c as Matt at GH has said it still won't keep up with XDI-60, especially when running e85.
But not having much luck finding something that can feed more than the 300c on the market. Anybody know any outfit that might be able to indulge me? I was holding getting the 300c but now I'm figuring it would be better than nothing...
Any thoughts guys? Thanks in advance!
Quote from: aresix6 on April 01, 2020, 11:43:05 PM
So I've got an XDI HPFP-60 along with their upgraded +50% injectors. I'm still running stock LPFP pump because I was trying to figure a solution that might feed more than the 300c as Matt at GH has said it still won't keep up with XDI-60, especially when running e85.
But not having much luck finding something that can feed more than the 300c on the market. Anybody know any outfit that might be able to indulge me? I was holding getting the 300c but now I'm figuring it would be better than nothing...
Any thoughts guys? Thanks in advance!
You should ping Eco Power Parts ( www.ecopowerparts.com ) as Mike Bambic the owner used to sell a dual in tank pump setup that could flow enough for E85. I don't think it's listed anymore but if you email him he might be able to help.
I'm running the DW pump and added a Kenne Bell boost a pump. So far its holding up pretty well... My tuner says I have the best LPFP readings he's seen yet. Running stock injectors however with Livernois Firestorm HPFP. (Not severe duty.)
Quote from: StinkinLinkin13 on April 02, 2020, 01:44:51 PM
I'm running the DW pump and added a Kenne Bell boost a pump. So far its holding up pretty well... My tuner says I have the best LPFP readings he's seen yet. Running stock injectors however with Livernois Firestorm HPFP. (Not severe duty.)
Did you end up doing the splice kit with the BAP? Or do they have a ford kit that actually works for ours?
KB89069 BOOST-A-PUMP 17.5V
(ALL VEHICLES - "STREET")
That's the model they said I needed. Not the Ford "plug and play". I didn't use the Boost Activation Switch so it was a super easy install. According to their directions it is not needed in Fords pulse width modulated systems.
Quote from: StinkinLinkin13 on April 02, 2020, 10:09:55 PM
KB89069 BOOST-A-PUMP 17.5V
(ALL VEHICLES - "STREET")
That's the model they said I needed. Not the Ford "plug and play". I didn't use the Boost Activation Switch so it was a super easy install. According to their directions it is not needed in Fords pulse width modulated systems.
Did you use the instructions from KB?
Yes.