Ecoboost Performance Forum

Ecoboost Performance => Troubleshooting, Maintenance, TSB Articles => PCV/Catch Cans => Topic started by: WhitePlatinumSHO on April 30, 2014, 09:36:13 PM

Title: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: WhitePlatinumSHO on April 30, 2014, 09:36:13 PM
Just got an oil separator from JLT. Going to install it on the weekend, but if it's anything like their Mustang products....it will work awesome. Anyone have one already? Curious how much oil it actually collects over a set period of time....
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: EcoPowerParts on April 30, 2014, 09:52:12 PM
Take a read - not the same catch can but close from my understanding:
http://www.f150forum.com/f70/upr-vs-rx-catch-can-effectiveness-test-254381/ (http://www.f150forum.com/f70/upr-vs-rx-catch-can-effectiveness-test-254381/)
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: WhitePlatinumSHO on April 30, 2014, 09:54:06 PM
Thanks. Don't get me started on UPR though... :0
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: BiGMaC on April 30, 2014, 10:20:02 PM
Quote from: 4DRHTRD on April 30, 2014, 09:52:12 PM
Take a read - not the same catch can but close from my understanding:
http://www.f150forum.com/f70/upr-vs-rx-catch-can-effectiveness-test-254381/ (http://www.f150forum.com/f70/upr-vs-rx-catch-can-effectiveness-test-254381/)

Wonder how long it will be before there's any results?... looked like it would take a while.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: nitrous_mike on April 30, 2014, 11:29:29 PM
Quote from: RedCandySHO on April 30, 2014, 09:54:06 PM
Thanks. Don't get me started on UPR though... :0

LOL you sound like me...... When I was running in NMRA they offered to give me a front end kit and I just laughed why would I take out a PA racing front end for  something that is well you know...

I wonder how well an electric vacuum scavenger would work on these cars ?
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: EcoPowerParts on May 01, 2014, 12:25:04 AM
Great article on the RX catch can.
http://www.f150ecoboost.net/forum/6-f150-ecoboost-chat/4056-revx-pcv-filtration-installed-working-yuck.html (http://www.f150ecoboost.net/forum/6-f150-ecoboost-chat/4056-revx-pcv-filtration-installed-working-yuck.html)
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: JimiJak on May 01, 2014, 01:53:00 AM
Quote from: RedCandySHO on April 30, 2014, 09:36:13 PM
Just got an oil separator from JLT. Going to install it on the weekend, but if it's anything like their Mustang products....it will work awesome. Anyone have one already? Curious how much oil it actually collects over a set period of time....

Can't wait for pics and results!
...hey, that reminds me; didn't SHOboat install some Moroso's a while back. Oh yeah...here it is. (http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php?topic=2584.0) I wonder what ever happened with that??
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: WhitePlatinumSHO on May 10, 2014, 06:28:25 PM
JLT Oil Separator is installed.....will check it in a few weeks to see how much it catches. Simple install....comes with everything required to simply connect (Factory quick connectors etc.) it etc.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: SHOdded on May 10, 2014, 09:03:20 PM
Kewl!  More firsthand data :thumb:
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: Tuner Boost on May 10, 2014, 09:47:37 PM
RX challenge:

You can do the same challenge, but bear in mind, the UPR is more effective than the JLT, so expect most to get pulled right past and still be ingested.

Anyone with any can that wants to do the test, you will never look at catchcans the same way again.

Up for testing the JLT with the RX behind it to show how much gets past it?  Any can that allows the oil to pass right through may give you a "placebo" effect thinking you are addressing the issue, but until to personally test and see you won't believe how much is pulled right past 99% of the cans on the market no matter what the brand, or what the manufacturer claims.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: Dxlnt1 on May 13, 2014, 10:40:14 PM
So is a catch can really necessary? Or has Ford designed these engines to allow for that blow by?
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: SHOdded on May 13, 2014, 11:23:17 PM
Looks like the RX catch can does collect blowby.  Blowby does tend to accumulate and gunk up the engine systems over time.  Supposed to be burnt up during the combustion process, but it does have to travel to get to the combustion chamber.  Guess what happens along the way?  That's right, unwanted deposits!!!  Not optimal for engine efficiency, and certainly not for cleanliness.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: explorergotoluvit on May 13, 2014, 11:31:35 PM
its real important any performance turbo engines subys bmw vw now are stuff its just good to have
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: Dxlnt1 on May 13, 2014, 11:57:29 PM
Quote from: SHOdded on May 13, 2014, 11:23:17 PM
Looks like the RX catch can does collect blowby.  Blowby does tend to accumulate and gunk up the engine systems over time.  Supposed to be burnt up during the combustion process, but it does have to travel to get to the combustion chamber.  Guess what happens along the way?  That's right, unwanted deposits!!!  Not optimal for engine efficiency, and certainly not for cleanliness.

So engine cleaners such as Techron wouldnt be sufficient to clean those deposits? Just asking
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: SHOdded on May 14, 2014, 12:00:30 AM
Problem is you have a GDI engine, and a TC one at that.  So any cleaner you add to the fuel only gets to the injectors and the combustion chamber.  You miss cleaning the intake tract, the intake valves, the turbo system, you get the picture. 
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: Dxlnt1 on May 14, 2014, 01:53:14 AM
Quote from: SHOdded on May 14, 2014, 12:00:30 AM
Problem is you have a GDI engine, and a TC one at that.  So any cleaner you add to the fuel only gets to the injectors and the combustion chamber.  You miss cleaning the intake tract, the intake valves, the turbo system, you get the picture.

Point taken, duly noted. Thanks. Now gotta add this to list of things to do. But first brakes.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: JimiJak on May 14, 2014, 04:23:24 AM
It's a bit of a read, but totally worth it to check THIS (http://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,2142.0.html) out.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: BiGMaC on May 14, 2014, 10:17:07 AM
Quote from: SHOdded on May 14, 2014, 12:00:30 AM
Problem is you have a GDI engine, and a TC one at that.  So any cleaner you add to the fuel only gets to the injectors and the combustion chamber.  You miss cleaning the intake tract, the intake valves, the turbo system, you get the picture. 

Point well taken Manu  :beer2: ... No fuel additive cleans the turbos, CAC and TB,   ....but there are some gains/cleaning of all components in direct contact with the combustion chamber with BG44 documented in the BG testing over a 61K time period in a 2011 SHO including the intake valves  :thumb:  ... It's here: http://www.bgprod.com/bgfueltest/ (http://www.bgprod.com/bgfueltest/) and dyno evidence of restored HP and TQ... Just as FYI
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: SHOdded on May 14, 2014, 11:23:28 AM
Right on, Tom!  And the beauty of the catch can theory/system is it is preventive, rather than curative.  Enough of us are fanatical about the insides of the engines as we are about the outside of our cars.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: Tuner Boost on May 14, 2014, 11:47:02 AM
Quote from: BiGMaC on May 14, 2014, 10:17:07 AM
Quote from: SHOdded on May 14, 2014, 12:00:30 AM
Problem is you have a GDI engine, and a TC one at that.  So any cleaner you add to the fuel only gets to the injectors and the combustion chamber.  You miss cleaning the intake tract, the intake valves, the turbo system, you get the picture. 

Point well taken Manu  :beer2: ... No fuel additive cleans the turbos, CAC and TB,   ....but there are some gains/cleaning of all components in direct contact with the combustion chamber with BG44 documented in the BG testing over a 61K time period in a 2011 SHO including the intake valves  :thumb:  ... It's here: http://www.bgprod.com/bgfueltest/ (http://www.bgprod.com/bgfueltest/) and dyno evidence of restored HP and TQ... Just as FYI


On todays DI engines there is actually zero effect from BG (which I like and use in Port injection engines) as no where in the entire fuel and combustion chamber does it ever contact any area but the piston tops to prevent any of this. Even though they did the most long term test, it is physically impossible for it to even keep injectors clean as they are operating at 2,000 plus PSI vs the old 45-55 PSI when the injectors would build up deposits over time. What they DID improve was doing an upper induction cleaning to help and that will result in removing some of the deposits resulting in increased power.....but that is dealing with the issue AFTER the deposits form. Best to prevent them from the start, and only a can that stops all the oil mist and gunk can do that. A JLT or other can WILL help slow the formation, so never a waste to use a can that only catches part of the mix....but only a can that catches all will prevent it, and we have the RX challenge open to any can on the market.

Here are good illustrations showing:

This is a port injection system showing how the valves were constantly showered with fuel spray from the injector, and top tier fuels (shell, mobil, etc. ) with detergent additives and other cleaners added to the fuel tank:

(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1044/Portinjectioncutaway_zps9ce9e1db.jpg)

And here is direct injection. As you can see, no top tier fuel, no additive will ever touch the valves:

(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1045/Directinjectioncutaway_zpsbecffb3e.jpg)

And further, here are pictures of a LS1 head from a 98 vette with 140k miles on it and just look, not a spec of deposits anywhere the fuel spray made contact:

(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1047/DSCN0661_zpsa58d6d74.jpg)
(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1047/DSCN0662_zpsffbb3f93.jpg)
(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1047/DSCN0663_zpsd8b69262.jpg)
(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1047/DSCN0665_zps6c3f85b5.jpg)


Now here is a 2014 DI engine with 3200 miles on it...look close, the deposits are already forming, and the valve stem on the pic with it open shows the abrasive particles already begining to cause wear (and the guide will wear many times faster due to the material and hardness):

(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1043/C7May10141547cylinder_1_zps75550081.jpg)
(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1043/C7LT1May10141746cylinder_6_zps70f0e8d1.jpg)

Now, using an upper induction cleaning is fine a few times, but be aware that every time these hard deposits are broken loose some are forced between the piston and cylinder wall causing scouring (scratches) and that is NOT good, so use a BG or SeaFoam rarely.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: SHOdded on May 14, 2014, 11:54:53 AM
I'd like to add that any cleaning system you use, a motor oil/filter change within 500 miles is a MUST.  A second change in 1,000 miles or so is also very helpful per user experiences I have read on other forums.  Maybe read up on AutoRx instructions on how to use their system.  They also suggest replacing the PCV valve.

http://www.auto-rx.com/faqs-eng.shtml (http://www.auto-rx.com/faqs-eng.shtml)
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: BiGMaC on May 14, 2014, 12:01:33 PM
Tracey.... no argument on the lack of full system cleaning... Or on the idea of not letting deposits build up before using an upper system cleaner.  My post is not intended  to suggest a substitute for the catch can.... which is likely the solution that BG mentions in the article.  But... both of us must trust the boroscope pics in the article.  Again it is not the best solution... but the article is still one with multiple points to ponder.
http://www.bgprod.com/bgfueltest/ (http://www.bgprod.com/bgfueltest/)

Quote from: Tuner Boost on May 14, 2014, 11:47:02 AM
Quote from: BiGMaC on May 14, 2014, 10:17:07 AM
Quote from: SHOdded on May 14, 2014, 12:00:30 AM
Problem is you have a GDI engine, and a TC one at that.  So any cleaner you add to the fuel only gets to the injectors and the combustion chamber.  You miss cleaning the intake tract, the intake valves, the turbo system, you get the picture. 

Point well taken Manu  :beer2: ... No fuel additive cleans the turbos, CAC and TB,   ....but there are some gains/cleaning of all components in direct contact with the combustion chamber with BG44 documented in the BG testing over a 61K time period in a 2011 SHO including the intake valves  :thumb:  ... It's here: http://www.bgprod.com/bgfueltest/ (http://www.bgprod.com/bgfueltest/) and dyno evidence of restored HP and TQ... Just as FYI


On todays DI engines there is actually zero effect from BG (which I like and use in Port injection engines) as no where in the entire fuel and combustion chamber does it ever contact any area but the piston tops to prevent any of this. Even though they did the most long term test, it is physically impossible for it to even keep injectors clean as they are operating at 2,000 plus PSI vs the old 45-55 PSI when the injectors would build up deposits over time. What they DID improve was doing an upper induction cleaning to help and that will result in removing some of the deposits resulting in increased power.....but that is dealing with the issue AFTER the deposits form. Best to prevent them from the start, and only a can that stops all the oil mist and gunk can do that. A JLT or other can WILL help slow the formation, so never a waste to use a can that only catches part of the mix....but only a can that catches all will prevent it, and we have the RX challenge open to any can on the market.

Here are good illustrations showing:

This is a port injection system showing how the valves were constantly showered with fuel spray from the injector, and top tier fuels (shell, mobil, etc. ) with detergent additives and other cleaners added to the fuel tank:

(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1044/Portinjectioncutaway_zps9ce9e1db.jpg)

And here is direct injection. As you can see, no top tier fuel, no additive will ever touch the valves:

(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1045/Directinjectioncutaway_zpsbecffb3e.jpg)

And further, here are pictures of a LS1 head from a 98 vette with 140k miles on it and just look, not a spec of deposits anywhere the fuel spray made contact:

(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1047/DSCN0661_zpsa58d6d74.jpg)
(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1047/DSCN0662_zpsffbb3f93.jpg)
(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1047/DSCN0663_zpsd8b69262.jpg)
(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1047/DSCN0665_zps6c3f85b5.jpg)


Now here is a 2014 DI engine with 3200 miles on it...look close, the deposits are already forming, and the valve stem on the pic with it open shows the abrasive particles already begining to cause wear (and the guide will wear many times faster due to the material and hardness):

(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1043/C7May10141547cylinder_1_zps75550081.jpg)
(http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/RevXtreme1/RevXtreme1043/C7LT1May10141746cylinder_6_zps70f0e8d1.jpg)

Now, using an upper induction cleaning is fine a few times, but be aware that every time these hard deposits are broken loose some are forced between the piston and cylinder wall causing scouring (scratches) and that is NOT good, so use a BG or SeaFoam rarely.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: Tuner Boost on May 14, 2014, 05:36:28 PM
Sho, glad you pointed that out!!! Can't tell you how many rod bearing failures after an upper induction cleaning that did NOT do the oil changes!   Just imagine what enters the oil during the process. Good catch.

Mac, totally agree with you.  The test is one of the most thorough I have seen and the comments as they watched the coking build and performance deteriorate are accurate. And the power was restored from the regular cleanings as well.

And these guys new exactly what they were doing.  Anyone that has had a proper BG treatment that had a good amount of miles on a DI engine can attest the difference is night and day better.

:thumbsup:

Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: Tuner Boost on June 02, 2014, 05:40:46 PM
Here is the latest results of independent testing the RX can with others.  We see the same results with JLT and Moroso:

Test Results

- I'll summarize the test to date. The first phase was to test the UPR vs the RX catch cans on a 5.0, both base models, with the UPR first in line and RX installed to catch anything the UPR missed. Those first phase results were: UPR - 17cc, RX - 67cc. The 'first in line' UPR caught 20% of the total volume. See post 37 in this thread for more details. The cans were cleaned and reinstalled in reverse order for phase 2, RX first and then UPR.

Phase 2 Test Results
- The Weather has been average northern Ohio spring weather. Some rain, fog, cool nights, warm and hot days.

- Driving has been about the same through both phases. I good mix of rural roads, some small towns, highways, and approximately 40% of the miles on interstates at 65 - 80mph. Mostly average style driving, with a few very heavy accelerations mixed in. A little heavy hauling, and no towing.

- What they caught this time might have been predicted by some (after the results of phase 1). RX was first in line, with the UPR after it to catch anything the RX might miss.
The combined volume of gunk was half of that caught in the first phase. The first phase had some cold weather which accounted for more water in the mix and the higher volume.
The contents from the RX can was mostly oil/fuel, and had a strong chemical/solvent smell again. It caught 35.5cc total which is approximately 7 1/8 tsp.
The UPR can caught about the same mix of oil/fuel, but didn't smell quite as strong. Halfway through this phase, Joe@UPR asked me to remove the mesh on the exit side of the UPR can. I did that, but noticed no difference in what it was catching. But since it was second in line, and there was little to catch, that's understandable. The UPR can caught 1.75cc total which is approximately 1/3 tsp. With so little collecting this time, I monitored the contents of the UPR can but didn't empty it until the end of the test.

- Phase 2 Totals:
RX - 35.5cc
UPR - 1.75cc

- Other tidbits include the 'first in line' RX can caught 95% of the total volume. The exit hoses were very clean from both cans. The last few tanks of gas have produced slightly higher than my normal MPGs, but it's too early to tell on that.



We urge all to do the test in reverse as well to be fair and accurate.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: Tomc612 on August 10, 2014, 03:32:41 PM
My JLT works and does its Job..I see about 1/2 tablespoon @ 4-5000k's in the colder month's and not much during the Summer. I run a S&B breather in the front.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: The Bone on August 10, 2014, 07:29:18 PM
Oil cant get to the turbos because they are upstream of the PVC valve. The amount of oil they will catch is minimal but may be worth the install. I to am curious as to how much you will catch. They have them on GT500's and they do catch some oil but it seems to be very little. It all depends on how you drive the car. if you are on the pipe all the time than you may see some oil but Hard to see how oil will get in a intake system with the positive pressure in the intake produced by the turbos. I 6think this only occurs during normal driving when the motor is producing vacuum.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: FPO on December 04, 2014, 07:40:16 PM
I would say my jlt catch can works...

I cleaned it  15 days  ago
about 10 ml of oil

(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k91/shadyninja2/E2BE7C0E-561C-483C-9BE3-9002A8FD9E22.jpg)
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: FoMoCoSHO on December 14, 2014, 02:36:38 PM
Quote from: The Bone on August 10, 2014, 07:29:18 PM
Oil cant get to the turbos because they are upstream of the PVC valve. The amount of oil they will catch is minimal but may be worth the install. I to am curious as to how much you will catch. They have them on GT500's and they do catch some oil but it seems to be very little. It all depends on how you drive the car. if you are on the pipe all the time than you may see some oil but Hard to see how oil will get in a intake system with the positive pressure in the intake produced by the turbos. I 6think this only occurs during normal driving when the motor is producing vacuum.
That isn't accurate. Under boost, PCV operation stops and and pressure is evacuated out the clean side right into the front turbo inlet.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: BiGMaC on December 14, 2014, 03:45:56 PM
Quote from: FoMoCoSHO on December 14, 2014, 02:36:38 PM
Quote from: The Bone on August 10, 2014, 07:29:18 PM
Oil cant get to the turbos because they are upstream of the PVC valve. The amount of oil they will catch is minimal but may be worth the install. I to am curious as to how much you will catch. They have them on GT500's and they do catch some oil but it seems to be very little. It all depends on how you drive the car. if you are on the pipe all the time than you may see some oil but Hard to see how oil will get in a intake system with the positive pressure in the intake produced by the turbos. I 6think this only occurs during normal driving when the motor is producing vacuum.
That isn't accurate. Under boost, PCV operation stops and and pressure is evacuated out the clean side right into the front turbo inlet.

This is true!  Just look at the tubing.  If your not VTA the compressed oil vapor is also returned to the turbo intake tubes.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: FoMoCoSHO on December 14, 2014, 04:33:31 PM
The Ford tech training video shows this clearly btw.....
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: salsathe4th on March 30, 2016, 01:01:10 PM
Quote from: FPO on December 04, 2014, 07:40:16 PM
I would say my jlt catch can works...

I cleaned it  15 days  ago
about 10 ml of oil

(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k91/shadyninja2/E2BE7C0E-561C-483C-9BE3-9002A8FD9E22.jpg)

How long was the time interval between emptying out? Im thinking about getting the JLT catch can (ease of installation and cheaper) but I wanna know just how effective it is. My car is now over 90,000 miles and want to have it last till at least 150,000.  :x:
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: metroplex on June 20, 2016, 05:13:35 AM
The JLT separator on my 4.6L 3V V8 Mustang GT has almost gotten completely filled in under 2000 miles. It depends on how you drive it.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: metroplex on December 31, 2016, 01:50:55 PM
Has anyone installed their new 3.0 separator? I noticed they used Air Brake hose, with the pin holes that allow moisture to escape. This seems to cause excessive fuel vapors to seep through the hose, into the engine compartment, and go through the HVAC system. Their separator from last year used the Ford nylon stiff hose (at least for my Mustang) which is the OEM hose PCV/vapor/fuel systems.
Title: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: MiWiAu on December 31, 2016, 06:40:55 PM
Quote from: metroplex on December 31, 2016, 01:50:55 PM
Has anyone installed their new 3.0 separator? I noticed they used Air Brake hose, with the pin holes that allow moisture to escape. This seems to cause excessive fuel vapors to seep through the hose, into the engine compartment, and go through the HVAC system. Their separator from last year used the Ford nylon stiff hose (at least for my Mustang) which is the OEM hose PCV/vapor/fuel systems.

I used Gates 1/2" PCV hose for mine. No pin holes. I don't notice any smell.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: MiWiAu on December 31, 2016, 07:25:15 PM
Quote from: MiWiAu on December 31, 2016, 06:40:55 PM
Quote from: metroplex on December 31, 2016, 01:50:55 PM
Has anyone installed their new 3.0 separator? I noticed they used Air Brake hose, with the pin holes that allow moisture to escape. This seems to cause excessive fuel vapors to seep through the hose, into the engine compartment, and go through the HVAC system. Their separator from last year used the Ford nylon stiff hose (at least for my Mustang) which is the OEM hose PCV/vapor/fuel systems.

I used Gates 1/2" PCV hose for mine. No pin holes. I don't notice any smell. This is an RX can.

I got extra Gates hose from my local NAPA. Maybe you could switch out your hose?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: metroplex on December 31, 2016, 07:27:54 PM
Quote from: MiWiAu on December 31, 2016, 06:40:55 PM
Quote from: metroplex on December 31, 2016, 01:50:55 PM
Has anyone installed their new 3.0 separator? I noticed they used Air Brake hose, with the pin holes that allow moisture to escape. This seems to cause excessive fuel vapors to seep through the hose, into the engine compartment, and go through the HVAC system. Their separator from last year used the Ford nylon stiff hose (at least for my Mustang) which is the OEM hose PCV/vapor/fuel systems.

I used Gates 1/2" PCV hose for mine. No pin holes. I don't notice any smell.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I see that you're using the Gates hose with your RX can. My JLT separator shipped directly from JLT with the Thermoid Air Brake hoses, and Vinny even sent me photos of their own install on a SHO using the Thermoid Air Brake hoses!

The Thermoid air brake hoses have evenly spaced "pin holes":
http://www.tectran.com/images/pdf/TB_pinpricks.pdf (http://www.tectran.com/images/pdf/TB_pinpricks.pdf)

After reading that, I am really really surprised that someone even decided to use these on an oil separator installed in a PCV environment.
The air brake hoses are almost totally saturated in fuel vapor fumes right now. The wire looms I used to cover the hoses are also saturated in fumes. I thought I had a massive fuel leak in the engine compartment, and even thought my open breather was causing those fumes.

I bought the Gates 1/2" PCV/Fuel hoses from O'Reilly's ready to install. What kind of hose clamps did you use?

I'm going to re-use the stock PCV hose and then run the open breather to see if there's any impact. Then re-install the PCV system.

What kind of oil/moisture is your RX catching? The JLT only catches a lot of fuel vapor, not much (if any) oil at all. I guess the stock factory oil separator works really well.
Title: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: MiWiAu on December 31, 2016, 07:48:03 PM
Quote from: metroplex on December 31, 2016, 07:27:54 PM
Quote from: MiWiAu on December 31, 2016, 06:40:55 PM
Quote from: metroplex on December 31, 2016, 01:50:55 PM
Has anyone installed their new 3.0 separator? I noticed they used Air Brake hose, with the pin holes that allow moisture to escape. This seems to cause excessive fuel vapors to seep through the hose, into the engine compartment, and go through the HVAC system. Their separator from last year used the Ford nylon stiff hose (at least for my Mustang) which is the OEM hose PCV/vapor/fuel systems.

I used Gates 1/2" PCV hose for mine. No pin holes. I don't notice any smell.


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I see that you're using the Gates hose with your RX can. My JLT separator shipped directly from JLT with the Thermoid Air Brake hoses, and Vinny even sent me photos of their own install on a SHO using the Thermoid Air Brake hoses!

The Thermoid air brake hoses have evenly spaced "pin holes":
http://www.tectran.com/images/pdf/TB_pinpricks.pdf (http://www.tectran.com/images/pdf/TB_pinpricks.pdf)

After reading that, I am really really surprised that someone even decided to use these on an oil separator installed in a PCV environment.
The air brake hoses are almost totally saturated in fuel vapor fumes right now. The wire looms I used to cover the hoses are also saturated in fumes. I thought I had a massive fuel leak in the engine compartment, and even thought my open breather was causing those fumes.

I bought the Gates 1/2" PCV/Fuel hoses from O'Reilly's ready to install. What kind of hose clamps did you use?

I'm going to re-use the stock PCV hose and then run the open breather to see if there's any impact. Then re-install the PCV system.

What kind of oil/moisture is your RX catching? The JLT only catches a lot of fuel vapor, not much (if any) oil at all. I guess the stock factory oil separator works really well.

I did not use any hose clamps on the actual OCC connections, since they were pretty tight barbed connections, but for the check valves, etc, I just used a standard stainless worm gear hose clamp. For some of the tighter connections, I used a tiny bit of dielectric grease to slide the hose over the connectors.

Seems like the pinholes have the possibility of reducing the overall efficacy of the catch can due to lower vacuum. I don't like the idea of that, personally. Dunno. Just seems weird. Maybe an inquiry to JLT asking why they chose to use that hose?

I just got back from a 1000 mi road trip and got another 13 oz from my drain. Looks like maybe 60% water, and the rest looks like a muddy/milky mixture of something plus a little bit (maybe 5%) of some oily snot. Hard to say the exact composition without an analysis.


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Title: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: MiWiAu on December 31, 2016, 07:54:07 PM
This is another 13oz Rx drain after a recent 1000 mi road trip. Mostly highway miles with very few cooling cycles, in between startups. Engine was warm for most of these miles so warmup condensation would have been minimal. (http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170101/473d5534e33c46d30d0c082c1be26995.jpg)


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Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: SHOdded on January 01, 2017, 01:02:45 AM
XSport Root Beer Float.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: metroplex on January 01, 2017, 09:18:06 AM
That doesn't look like oil to me, maybe some of the milky substance. My Mustang GT (4.6L 3V) has a JLT that collects 100% oil, and I have to empty it out like every 300-500 miles so it is collecting about 1 oz every 1000 miles. I would just pour it back into the engine as there wasn't any moisture or byproduct.

The EcoBoost, from everything I have seen, seems to have an effective oil separator on the valve cover, it's just the condensation/vapor collection is quite a lot - probably from the GTDI fuel dilution? I know the 2016 SHOs got rid of the factory oil separator, I'm wondering if the 2015-up Explorer Sports are the same way.

I've got the new Gates PCV hose ready to go on there to test. You should have smelled my SHO with the JLT-equipped airbrake hoses. The hoses reeked of gasoline, and it was wafting through the engine compartment and into the ventilation ducts. I can't believe an engineer would approve that design.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: MiWiAu on January 01, 2017, 08:11:39 PM
In my OCC how-to write up, there are some pictures in the beginning of the thread of oil pooling in the CAC outlet pipe to the point where it was seeping out of the intake tube and collecting on the valve cover. I definitely had motor oil in the intake system. I'm sure this had been collecting for the ~29,000 or so miles since the vehicle was new, but since installing the OCC, CSS, and doing the BOV VTA, I have not seen any oil return to my intake plumbing in the ~7,000mi since install, so one of those things must be doing something. :)


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Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: metroplex on January 01, 2017, 09:16:57 PM
Can you take a pic of your rear valve cover PCV connection? I'm curious to see if the X sports are the same.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: MiWiAu on January 01, 2017, 09:18:32 PM
Quote from: metroplex on January 01, 2017, 09:16:57 PM
Can you take a pic of your rear valve cover PCV connection? I'm curious to see if the X sports are the same.

Yep! I'll grab one one tomorrow when the sun comes out. :)


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Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: metroplex on January 03, 2017, 11:49:33 AM
Mike,
As an update I contacted Thermoid, the manufacturer of the J1402A air brake hoses that JLT used for the JLT 3.0 separator. They said it is not rated for gasoline/fuel. I read J1402A and it only covers environmental resistance against oil, water, and ozone - which makes sense. Thermoid even said their air brake hoses have pin holes that would allow fuel vapors to escape. Thermoid recommend their SAE J30R6 or SAE J30R7 hoses for this application, which happens to be the SAE spec for PCV/EEC/Fuel hoses.

JLT did finally respond, but the fact remains the hoses were weeping out gas fumes in an engine compartment to the point I could smell the gas fumes in the garage.

Hopefully this doesn't happen to anyone else but it seems like EcoBoost owners are all using UPR or RX anyhow.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: MiWiAu on January 03, 2017, 09:46:02 PM
That's wild that they would choose to use that hose. I wonder if that's the stuff they've been using since inception, or if it was a recent change. Thanks for the follow-up!

I still owe you a picture of my rear separator. I will try to do that first thing in the AM before I get sidetracked again. :)
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: metroplex on January 03, 2017, 09:53:33 PM
I think it depends on the application. Mustangs have gotten the hard OEM nylon tubing. I also saw the Thermoid air brake hose on other applications. If the engine isn't too boosted or doesn't have a lot of fuel dilution, air brake hose might be ok especall on a Mustang Gt where it may only see oil . As an engineer, I wouldn't even have bothered with that hose material though especially for this application.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: ChrisJ on February 01, 2017, 08:57:41 AM
I run a JLT separator on my sho. Easy install but I am not noticing nearly the amount of collection some of you are. I went with JLT because Jay has always treated me right. Been using his products since he was making them one off out of requests on forums. 
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: MiWiAu on February 01, 2017, 12:32:00 PM
Quote from: ChrisJ on February 01, 2017, 08:57:41 AM
I run a JLT separator on my sho. Easy install but I am not noticing nearly the amount of collection some of you are. I went with JLT because Jay has always treated me right. Been using his products since he was making them one off out of requests on forums.

Did your kit also come with air brake hose? Curious if you were/are smelling fuel vapor like metroplex.

If you wanted to increase the efficiency of your JLT, you could also tee into the intake piping to provide PCV evacuation under boost. If memory serves, the JLT only connects to the IM, correct? In this case you would only get vacuum at cruise when you're not running any boost.

My RX collection is mostly water with a little oil. I'm guessing my collection volumes will be much lower when spring/summer rolls around and there is less moisture circulating through the system.


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Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: ChrisJ on February 01, 2017, 12:40:22 PM
Quote from: MiWiAu on February 01, 2017, 12:32:00 PM
Quote from: ChrisJ on February 01, 2017, 08:57:41 AM
I run a JLT separator on my sho. Easy install but I am not noticing nearly the amount of collection some of you are. I went with JLT because Jay has always treated me right. Been using his products since he was making them one off out of requests on forums.

Did your kit also come with air brake hose? Curious if you were/are smelling fuel vapor like metroplex.

If you wanted to increase the efficiency of your JLT, you could also tee into the intake piping to provide PCV evacuation under boost. If memory serves, the JLT only connects to the IM, correct? In this case you would only get vacuum at cruise when you're not running any boost.

My RX collection is mostly water with a little oil. I'm guessing my collection volumes will be much lower when spring/summer rolls around and there is less moisture circulating through the system.


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I think its only on the clean side.
Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: MiWiAu on February 01, 2017, 04:10:13 PM
That's the dirty side, and probably the intake manifold connection. The cleanside port is on the front bank near the oil fill cap. You don't need a catch can for the clean side, since that's primarily fresh air intake into the engine (with an occasional reverse flow burp).

This setup will not evacuate the dirty side during boost, but could be modified to do so fairly easily with some tees and check valves.


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Title: Re: JLT Oil Separator
Post by: AlexAvani on November 21, 2018, 06:47:00 PM
I put a jLT Oil separator.  Here is my install
https://youtu.be/EwcZtPXZaKM
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