So I've been thinking of methanol injection, and found it kinda tough to get specific info on a couple points. So I figured I'd just ask here.
1) How big are the performance gains going from 50/50 water-meth to 100% methanol. My car is a daily driver so I worry about having the flammable 100% meth in it. Since I'm always the one driving the wife and kid around, lol. If the difference is only a couple tenths slower by running 50/50 then I'll probably go that route.
2) If you are using the washer fluid reservoir as your methanol tank, does installing a meth kit require removing the bumper cover? That sounds like a pain. I asked the folks at Alky Control, and Julio Don said the kit for the SHO is done through Livernoise and requires pulling the bumper cover. When I asked if that was because of the tank, he said he wasn't sure and that I should ask Livernoise.
3) Since it's a daily driver, does meth come with any reliability issues? I would imagine that cooling the intake charge and raising the octane level would only help reliability, but I am a complete noob when it comes to meth.
4) Any other info I should know about to help decide if it's a good idea?
Thanks in advance guys. I always appreciate the help.
Quote from: Agentlongwood on July 14, 2018, 02:40:09 PM
So I've been thinking of methanol injection, and found it kinda tough to get specific info on a couple points. So I figured I'd just ask here.
1) How big are the performance gains going from 50/50 water-meth to 100% methanol. My car is a daily driver so I worry about having the flammable 100% meth in it. Since I'm always the one driving the wife and kid around, lol. If the difference is only a couple tenths slower by running 50/50 then I'll probably go that route.
2) If you are using the washer fluid reservoir as your methanol tank, does installing a meth kit require removing the bumper cover? That sounds like a pain. I asked the folks at Alky Control, and Julio Don said the kit for the SHO is done through Livernoise and requires pulling the bumper cover. When I asked if that was because of the tank, he said he wasn't sure and that I should ask Livernoise.
3) Since it's a daily driver, does meth come with any reliability issues? I would imagine that cooling the intake charge and raising the octane level would only help reliability, but I am a complete noob when it comes to meth.
4) Any other info I should know about to help decide if it's a good idea?
Thanks in advance guys. I always appreciate the help.
I can't answer number 1 as I only ran 100%... but based on what I have seen in datalogs, 50/50 won't cool as well as 100%...
1: Time slips vary soo much it's hard to tell if one is significantly faster than the other... I want to say 100% meth is a couple tenths faster.
2: Yes, you will need to take the front bumper off IF you install the same way as LMS. Taking off the front bumper is not a big ordeal... only 15 minutes or so. BPD1151 has a good write up on it.
3: Depends on the tune. LMS will not tune for dependency on methanol. So your pump could die while running an LMS tune and your car would be OK. There are benefits of it cleaning the back of the valves... and if you are tuned it helps stabilize the fuel pressure.
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Thanks for the input. I'm all worried about taking of the bumper cover since I drive an MKS instead of a SHO. When I put on a catch can, I read every how-to I could get my hands on. It was a pain in the butt since every little detail was juuuuuust different enough to make you mad. My car would be missing a tab here and a bolt-hole there, or have something shifted over just by an inch so that things wouldn't fit. Was a ton of fun, lol. I would love to find a really detailed write up for removing the bumper cover on a 2013+ MKS, since I think it would look great if I removed the vertical bar grilles and replaced them with black mesh, like the SHO gets.
The livernoise install doesn't use the washer fluid reservoir does it? I'm curious if that's the only reason theirs requires the removal of the bumper cover.
Quote from: Agentlongwood on July 14, 2018, 03:00:32 PM
Thanks for the input. I'm all worried about taking of the bumper cover since I drive an MKS instead of a SHO. When I put on a catch can, I read every how-to I could get my hands on. It was a pain in the butt since every little detail was juuuuuust different enough to make you mad. My car would be missing a tab here and a bolt-hole there, or have something shifted over just by an inch so that things wouldn't fit. Was a ton of fun, lol. I would love to find a really detailed write up for removing the bumper cover on a 2013+ MKS, since I think it would look great if I removed the vertical bar grilles and replaced them with black mesh, like the SHO gets.
The livernoise install doesn't use the washer fluid reservoir does it? I'm curious if that's the only reason theirs requires the removal of the bumper cover.
Yes, they use the washer fluid reservoir for meth but they ALSO mount the pump behind the bumper as well.
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I think you can get roughly the same cooling with 50/50 but it happens differently. I always think it's best to use 100% Meth but I've seen very good results with 50/50.
If you spray 50/50 you can get the cooling by spraying more of it. It won't have the same evaporative cooling that the pure meth gives you but because you are spraying more 50/50 you get the cooling.
If you are using pure meth then you don't really need the cooling anyway because you have the octane benefit.
The 50/50 will give you some cooling and some octane so depending on how much you spray, you can get what you need to give the spark you are looking for and additional fuel.
Some turbo cars use straight water injection to cool the charge temps. Those are typically race cars but it can be a viable option if only looking for cooling.
Thanks Brad, that explanation makes perfect sense. Everything I've read says that 100% methanol is better in multiple ways, it's just flammable. And you know me, and my tuning goals, lol. Super safe, and reliable are way higher priorities than speed and power. To the point that Brad probably gets annoyed with me, since I bet he could tune my car to run high 12s... But I was being a big baby and asked him to err on the safe side a lot, and landed at exactly 13.0, lol.
Why not look into the trunk mount kit? Works great for me and stays out of the way for when I load up the trunk with the kiddos toys.
Since your located in Fl you can always stop by to meetup with Julio (Alky Controls) Facility since your located in roughly the same neck of woods to get an estimate .
I was planning on visiting him a while back but unfortunately he was leaving for a flight out of town so plan accordingly......
FWIW Julio was installing a Meth kit last fall on a earlier build SHO! Just some food for thought. Z :)
Alkycontrol Inc
12303 Waltham Ave
Tampa FL 33624
I installed a snow kit on my 2013 MKS behind the bumper in front of the front passenger tire with a custom bracket that was just two pieces of angle aluminium attached to some sheet metal bracing right in that location. I also ran 100% meth. I just had to remove the wheel and liner. The bottom of the pump sat just below the washer tank and just to the left of it if you are looking at the front of the car. I used the tank to hold the meth. It was great until the pump literally started to dissolve from being in the elements. It was covered all around, there is a black plastic shroud on the bottom and the bumper on 2 sides, wheel well cover on another. It seemed that the temp changes caused condensation inside the motor/electrical portions of the pump and just ate it up. It could be the snow crap or its just a bad place to mount it. My window sprayer pump located in the tank also failed, then those shitty push connectors for the hoses started leaking after taking it apart a few times to fix the pump. Take it from me, just do a trunk mount kit, metal tank, screw on fittings everywhere and you will love it! The car never ran better than when it was on meth. I would chew up cars on hot summer days as they pulled timing and I added it because the car thought it was 32 degrees outside. Brad doesn't know it yet but he might be tuning a meth powered fusion sport in the future if I have the balls to buy another kit. Snow will never get a dime from me again.
Have you considered an E85 tune? I moved to that after the Meth, I am very happy with what Brad did with his E20/30 tunes.
Considered other fuels for sure. The performance is undeniable, just not my cup of tea. For this specific car, anyway. Since it's my daily I just want to be able to pop into any gas station and fill up whenever is convenient. Methanol I think I could tolerate since it sounds like a decent sized tank doesn't need to be filled up super often. I could absolutely go faster at the track, but I try to run the car exactly as it is when I'm driving around town. I leave everything in it, (even the carseat, lol) and leave the tire pressures at the same level and everything. I know it could run considerably faster on corn juice. I'm just much more interested in making it quick in day-to-day driving mode. Really don't want to have to blend fuel at every fill up, lol.
Oh I feel you! You and I have the exact same setup, car seat, wife and all LOL. I just went to corn after all the pump issues. Just get the Alkycontrols pump and you will be good! For me its not too bad because I have it all over, i just to 10 and 2. 0.2 of corn for each gallon of gas. I can estimate to the gallon how much i can fit in the tank based on the gauge in the car and its pretty quick to do. But meth will give better results, better in hot weather, easier to deal with "IF" you do it right and by quality parts. Don't make the mistake I did, Alkycontrols from the start and you will be happy!
Cant you use the MDesign intake and then the space created by removing the OEM air box for the Meth tank ?