Originally posted by bpd1151
EDIT- Making this thread a sticky until we have more "How-To" suspension threads, then we will group them into one. Thanks to Mike for the great information!! -Admin
Following the install of my H&R lowering springs, I learned a few things and thought I'd share with the community.
It took a lot of phone calls and emails on my part (more than I care to admit), but I was finally able to locate the availability of a product that will provide rear camber adjustability.
Even though there is a "slot" that in theory is supposed to provide some degree of rear camber adjustability, I (and several others I spoke to who also lowered their SHO's) were NOT able to regain the factory alignment specs without the use of the below listed product(s).
Once purchased and installed, I was successfully able to obtain OEM alignment specs on both rear tires of my lowered, 2010 SHO.
It will not matter which mfg'ers lowering springs you have chosen to use, this will provide you with that adjustability factor regardless.
Now, to start off.....
I ran into a huge, HUGE issue of most alignment places not having the factory alignment specs. Here is a copy of those specs from Hunter Corp...... if you run into this issue yourself, pull up this image and show it to the alignment tech and they should be able to manually "punch in" the numbers into their system.
(https://i.imgur.com/hIrCro3h.jpg)
Following the install of my lowering springs, I was faced with a sever negative camber issue on both rear tires. OEM specs called for a range of: -1.2 to 0.3 degrees. I had a -2.1 in the left rear, and a -2.3 in the right rear. See/Refer to the below images for "before and after" alignment, post spring install.
BEFORE ALIGNMENT SPECS: (H&R lowering springs installed, but NOT the adjustable cam bolt)
(https://i.imgur.com/spiSgO6h.jpg)
AFTER ALIGNMENT SPECS: (springs AND the adjustable cam bolts installed)
(https://i.imgur.com/wqbA0BWh.jpg)
Some of you may notice that in the image immediately above, where the alignment sheets shows the numbers AFTER the the lowerings and the adjustable camber bolt were installed, that the left rear shows a -1.6 number in the area listed "before". Which would be different from the original alignment specs sheet posted above...... no fear.
To clarify.... the tech claimed following the initial alignment attempt (post camber bolt install) that he "turned the bolt as much as he could".
When I pointed out to him that the right rear was well within spec, I insisted he give the left rear a second attempt (which he did) and surprise, surprise (well not to me at least) it worked like a charm!
I'll add that he did get a "larger" person who appeared much stronger, to turn the bolt a second time..... :RpS_tongue:
Now, I obtained an adjustable rear camber bolt from the following website:
http://www.spcalignment.com/ (http://www.spcalignment.com/)
The proper part number (which if you call them, they will deny this application works, but as you will see, IT DOES!) is: 81280
Now here's the kicker of it all, when it arrives at your door step, and open the package, you find enclosed along with the two bolts, two nuts that have the washers molded into them. I was told that these supplied nuts are to "tall" in height as it relates to the bolt itself, which is just barely long enough for the nut to grab enough thread.
It was suggested I obtain a nut that can be easily found at any local hardware store (in my case after visiting the large big box places, I ended up finding them at my local ACE Hardware. The nut I used was an M14.
By swapping out the supplied nut/washer combo supplied by SPC, with a shorter one I found at a local hardware store, these parts combined, worked successfully!
Here are couple of pictures of the supplied bolts/nuts from SPC, and the nut purchased afterwards.....
(https://i.imgur.com/c8r7Etth.jpg)
SPC bolt, w/ alternate nut (bottom bolt in this pic), compared side by side to the OEM bolt (top bolt in this pic).
(https://i.imgur.com/lAU9Iygh.jpg)
Now a question arose as to which bolt would be being replaced. The answer: swap out the upper spindle bolt from the OEM, to the SPC bolt/nut combo.....
(https://i.imgur.com/vh42f8th.jpg)
Here are a couple of "post install" pics of the bolt in place, as well as a closer up image of showing the alternate nut seated all the way onto the bolt itself....
(https://i.imgur.com/VeKlo16h.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/h8sIP87h.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/wD50hhNh.jpg)
So....... as you can all see, by using this combination of parts, etc etc...... the lack of rear camber adjustability from the factory has been resolved!!
What I found ironic was that upon calling Specialty Products, they denied that this product would work. They claimed ideally they (as a company) would prefer to look at the entire suspension set-up (of the 2010+ Taurus / SHO platform) and fab a product, or product(s) that would work harmoniously as a complete package set-up.
Well that's all fine and dandy, however in the interim, knowing I could obtain successful results I still pressed them further. The representative then stated that at best, I would only see a swing of perhaps .4 degrees +/- well like I said, as you can see from the alignment sheet posted above, I was able to achieve a lot more than that.
Oh yea, one last suggestion, throw some Loc-Tite onto those threads before cranking that nut down onto the bolt.
I hope this post is of some use to those of you who've lowered your SHO's :thumb:
-----------------------------------Mike
Comment by EB Bob:
GREAT INFO!
While my alignment guy was able to get my Flex rear alignment to spec. without those bolts (had a set handy), a number of Flex owners have had the same issue when lowering their Bricks. A Ford engineer poster claimed that this is caused by how the vehicles are built at the factory. He indicated that they are built within a range, and those at the wrong end of that range are harder to align.
Where to find, and SPC Info:
http://www.amazon.com/Specialty-Products-Company-81280-Adjuster/dp/B000CB3QUI/ (http://www.amazon.com/Specialty-Products-Company-81280-Adjuster/dp/B000CB3QUI/)
http://www.spcalignment.com/index.php?option=com_spc&task=part_description&pid=81280 (http://www.spcalignment.com/index.php?option=com_spc&task=part_description&pid=81280)
Part No. 81280 - Pair For replacement of 16mm bolts
Front Adjustment range: Camber ±1.75°
Installation time: .4 hr/side
Required: 1 kit per axle
SPC Installation Video:
http://youtu.be/ugrwZZbnjn4 (http://youtu.be/ugrwZZbnjn4)
Thank you for the link...saved me some $$$
Rich
Absolutely!!! Thanks again to bpd for this great writeup!
Can't believe ordering directly from their site is that much of a price hike.
Rich
Have to keep their distribution network happy, plus allows them to have "specials" :D
Ha, specials...thx again. Bought 2 sets shipped cheaper than 1 set through them.
Rich
I'm going through this headache right now! Just visited my ACE Hardware and found out there's several M14 style nuts! There's a Standard 9 quality nut, regular nut, and a hardened nut AND, there's different "pitches!" The typical pitches are 1.5 and 2.0 - this refers to the size of the thread on the bolt. Once I get these bolts in the mail on Thursday I'll know what pitch. I'll update my post with this info. Lastly, I assume since this is going on the suspension I'm going with the hardened nut.
Thanks SO much for this post!!!!
Quote from: EcoPowerParts on July 14, 2013, 12:54:24 PM
Originally posted by bpd1151
EDIT- Making this thread a sticky until we have more "How-To" suspension threads, then we will group them into one. Thanks to Mike for the great information!! -Admin
Now here's the kicker of it all, when it arrives at your door step, and open the package, you find enclosed along with the two bolts, two nuts that have the washers molded into them. I was told that these supplied nuts are to "tall" in height as it relates to the bolt itself, which is just barely long enough for the nut to grab enough thread.
It was suggested I obtain a nut that can be easily found at any local hardware store (in my case after visiting the large big box places, I ended up finding them at my local ACE Hardware. The nut I used was an M14.
By swapping out the supplied nut/washer combo supplied by SPC, with a shorter one I found at a local hardware store, these parts combined, worked successfully!
My question is: who told you that the supplied nuts are too "tall?" Did you try to use them? I got this reply today from them about NOT using their supplied nuts...
"My concern is that the bolt and the nut are coated and flanged, and that coating affects the toque value and therefore the clamp load of the strut your attaching. You can understand that clamp load is an important safety factor when working on the suspension of vehicles. Too little clamp load will cause the suspension to fail, while too much clamp load will cause the bolt to fail. We have tested the nut and bolt together to come up with a torque value that accounts for the coating and will give us the proper and safe clamp load. Replacing the nut changes everything and also will void any and all warranties."
Any issues since you did this mod using those ACE hardware nuts?
Thanks again!
-Eric
UPDATE - PLEASE READ THIS!... DO NOT BUY & USE A NUT FROM YOUR LOCAL HARDWARE STORE!!! USE THE BOLT & NUT THAT COMES IN THE PACKAGE!!!
The poster did an excellent job and write-up on this "how-to," issue regarding rear camber. BUT....the nut being "too tall," doesn't make any sense. It does NOT matter if the nut is tall, short, or what - the BIGGEST thing that matters is how many THREADS are grabbing the bolt. So it doesn't matter which nut you use since they both only grab about 4-5 threads!
I prefer to use the bolt that comes in the package because it has a special coating, the strength is like category 12, AND it has a shoulder on it which creates a more secure fit and stronger clamping force!
But MANY thanks to the poster because now my rear wheels are aligned and not driving me nuts!!!
Do you guys think we should sticky this in the suspension section?
Done!
Has anyone used the 81280 bolt alignment kit on the front with success? 2014 SHO here. Also, how bad of a wear do you guys see on the H&R lowered springs in the front that did not adjust the camber with this 81280 bolt kit (miles on tires,concerning inside wear of tire)?
Are these the same part number for a 2013 Flex?
Fits the 2013 SHO (OmaHahn above), so it should the Flex.
Finally! i have been waiting for this right up, i can finally fix my ugly rear camber. Livernois is also selling this product with their lowering springs i'm assuming it is the same bolt/nut. I believe they said you can order it from them for 39.99. :bravo: :bravo:
Quote from: zach_435 on May 18, 2016, 04:11:36 PMFinally! Ihave been waiting for this right up, i can finally fix my ugly rear camber. :bravo: :bravo:
"Finally" ????
I authored this "How-To" back in like 2011, and it was transferred over the year after to this community here.
I also had a friend of mine who worked in the R&D division of H&R that was instrumental in developing these based on my own direct experiences as outlined in the write up.
I was one of the 1st for the platform to lower their SHO's using the H&R's & had a bear of a time trying to reacquire OEM alignment specs.
LMS I believe is rebranding, or selling these through their company now, as a part of their product offerings.
Although I no longer am rocking the H&R's, & have since upgraded to the Megan Coil Overs, i still have my adjustable cam bolts in place.
Never have been an issue since their install, and I have many miles on them, daily driven, track abuse, etc.
It's still cool seeing people benefitting from this, and many others mods and "How-To's" I pioneered / authored.
Enjoy those SHO's everyone!
Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
yeah i noticed after i posted it how old it was it new news to me though
Still really helpful as i wasn't aware of this until i saw this.
Much appreciated
Quote from: CroR1 on March 25, 2016, 10:34:39 PM
Has anyone used the 81280 bolt alignment kit on the front with success? 2014 SHO here. Also, how bad of a wear do you guys see on the H&R lowered springs in the front that did not adjust the camber with this 81280 bolt kit (miles on tires,concerning inside wear of tire)?
Very curious about this, too. I already have wear on my 22's, but I would love to get the alignment back in spec by the time I replace tires.
hmm, i have a feeling I may see the same issue on the CD4 once the coils are on, got the endlinks, now I am wondering if I should get the cam bolts from whiteline as well.
Can't hurt to have 'em on standby.
Just researching this in case I purchase springs. Curious...On the SPCAlignment Site I see a different part number than the one reference earlier in this thread for the '10+ Taurus. Maybe they now make a model specific bolt for our application?
http://www.spcalignment.com/component/spc/?task=part_description&pid=84130®ion=USA&make=Ford&model=Taurus&year=2013%20-%202016&from=USAFrom&to=USATo (http://www.spcalignment.com/component/spc/?task=part_description&pid=84130®ion=USA&make=Ford&model=Taurus&year=2013%20-%202016&from=USAFrom&to=USATo)
Good question! The bolts look different as well:
81280
(http://www.spcalignment.com/partimages/81280.jpg)
84130
(http://www.spcalignment.com/partimages/84130.jpg)
What SPC shows for the Ford Taurus
(http://i1315.photobucket.com/albums/t597/PerfA_ZN0W/2010-up/SPC%20Camber%20Kits%20for%20Ford%20Taurus%2020160722_zps7cbwvwck.jpg)
I have a set of these bolts. part #81280 if anybody needs them. bought them and didn't use them.
ill be listing in the part forum as well.
Quote from: SHOdded on July 22, 2016, 06:49:08 PM
Good question! The bolts look different as well:
81280
(http://www.spcalignment.com/partimages/81280.jpg)
84130
(http://www.spcalignment.com/partimages/84130.jpg)
What SPC shows for the Ford Taurus
(http://i1315.photobucket.com/albums/t597/PerfA_ZN0W/2010-up/SPC%20Camber%20Kits%20for%20Ford%20Taurus%2020160722_zps7cbwvwck.jpg)
Anyone know which to go with on these two part numbers? I'd really like to try the Ford SPC (84130) type if they work, but I know the 81280's fit except that they're barely long enough. It'd be nice to have a bolt long enough to get past those first 4-5 threads... wondering if the 84130's will be better or worse - anyone tried them yet? I'm putting on new wheels and tires Friday, taking her to get aligned Saturday - I was going to order my camber bolts today, but debating which to go with... probably will just order both and see which works best and return the others, but thought I'd ask here first to see if anyone had experience with these others. Thx!
Quote from: bpd1151 on May 18, 2016, 04:24:07 PM
Quote from: zach_435 on May 18, 2016, 04:11:36 PMFinally! Ihave been waiting for this right up, i can finally fix my ugly rear camber. :bravo: :bravo:
"Finally" ????
I authored this "How-To" back in like 2011, and it was transferred over the year after to this community here.
I also had a friend of mine who worked in the R&D division of H&R that was instrumental in developing these based on my own direct experiences as outlined in the write up.
I was one of the 1st for the platform to lower their SHO's using the H&R's & had a bear of a time trying to reacquire OEM alignment specs.
LMS I believe is rebranding, or selling these through their company now, as a part of their product offerings.
Although I no longer am rocking the H&R's, & have since upgraded to the Megan Coil Overs, i still have my adjustable cam bolts in place.
Never have been an issue since their install, and I have many miles on them, daily driven, track abuse, etc.
It's still cool seeing people benefitting from this, and many others mods and "How-To's" I pioneered / authored.
Enjoy those SHO's everyone!
Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
Were you able to get to spec with the coilovers and these bolts?
Yes.
Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
So it appears there is no adjustment for the fronts on the 13+ application?
Is that because they're not needed?
Not entirely sure about the 13+'s as it pertains to the fronts, but on the 10's through 12's..... no, it's not needed as you say.
Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
Quote from: SHOdded on July 22, 2016, 06:49:08 PM
Good question! The bolts look different as well:
81280
(http://www.spcalignment.com/partimages/81280.jpg)
84130
(http://www.spcalignment.com/partimages/84130.jpg)
What SPC shows for the Ford Taurus
(http://i1315.photobucket.com/albums/t597/PerfA_ZN0W/2010-up/SPC%20Camber%20Kits%20for%20Ford%20Taurus%2020160722_zps7cbwvwck.jpg)
Was there ever an answer/response on these new bolts? Has anyone tried them? The 84130 is listed as rear, is nothing at all needed up front or do people use the 81280 in front and 84130 in rear?
I recently installed the Megan Racing Coilovers on my 2011 SHO and picked up the 84130 rear alignment bolts to get everything back within spec. I am taking my car in tomorrow for an alignment and will have the 84130s installed on the rear then. BPD said he didn't have to use any special bolts up front to get within alignment specs so I think your don't need to worry about that. I will let you know how it goes tomorrow. -Jeremy
Took the SHO in for an alignment today post Megan Coilover install. I drove the car for about a week to let things settle before taking it in. I purchased the SPC 84130 adjustable rear cam bolts and the mechanic didn't mention any issue with using them. I have not looked at the bolts and nuts post install but the mechanic didn't mention and issues with the nuts being too tall as was the case with the 81280 part number. The shop also adjusted the ride height on all four corners to match pre alignment. The mechanic was able to get everything but the rear drivers side camber within spec and that is only out of spec by 1/10th of a degree so I am not too worried about it. Also, had the shop rotate the tires since I had been driving out of alignment for a week or so while things settled. Hopefully, I can add a few notes to the Megan Coiliver install thread to clear up a few confusing points I ran into while installing the coilovers...nothing major but some things that could definitely save future installers some time. -Jeremy
:bigthanx: to many who have contributed there time and effort in keeping the Ecoboost community up to speed,but especially to bpd1151 for an exceptional "writeup" and our very own SHOdded with updating us on such valuable information that is going to help me towards the process of my H&R springs Installed. Z
Just as an FYI to anyone who wants to check camber at home to see where they stand this is a method i've used for years and proves to be relatively accurate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kT1eK55ZhJo
after letting my springs settle for a few hundred miles i came up with these angles. i think these are all within spec(barely on the PS front).
can anyone verify the spec on rear camber?
OP states -1.2 as max neg camber angle and Jeremy s. photo lists -1.8
and of course . . photos in this thread need fixed lol
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171105/b63313097c4e167977fe5cfeb3d8c2c9.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Quote from: Colorado-SHOBro on November 05, 2017, 01:31:43 PM
Just as an FYI to anyone who wants to check camber at home to see where they stand this is a method i've used for years and proves to be relatively accurate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kT1eK55ZhJo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kT1eK55ZhJo)
after letting my springs settle for a few hundred miles i came up with these angles. i think these are all within spec(barely on the PS front).
can anyone verify the spec on rear camber?
OP states -1.2 as max neg camber angle and Jeremy s. photo lists -1.8
and of course . . photos in this thread need fixed lol
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171105/b63313097c4e167977fe5cfeb3d8c2c9.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
This was using the must needed Specialty 81280 rear camber bolts. Z
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,8310.0.htmls (https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,8310.0.htmls)
(https://i.imgur.com/91bNTxTh.jpg?1) .Z
Quote from: ZSHO on November 05, 2017, 01:53:10 PM
Quote from: Colorado-SHOBro on November 05, 2017, 01:31:43 PM
Just as an FYI to anyone who wants to check camber at home to see where they stand this is a method i've used for years and proves to be relatively accurate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kT1eK55ZhJo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kT1eK55ZhJo)
after letting my springs settle for a few hundred miles i came up with these angles. i think these are all within spec(barely on the PS front).
can anyone verify the spec on rear camber?
OP states -1.2 as max neg camber angle and Jeremy s. photo lists -1.8
and of course . . photos in this thread need fixed lol
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171105/b63313097c4e167977fe5cfeb3d8c2c9.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
This was using the must needed Specialty 81280 rear camber bolts. Z
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,8310.0.htmls (https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php/topic,8310.0.htmls)
(https://i.imgur.com/91bNTxTh.jpg?1) .Z
Thanks for the pic Z. Are those specs from a Ford dealer or where? looks like they had to adjust your toe a little as well?
I have one 84130 camber bolt(didn't realize there was 1 to a box instead of 2) but doesn't look like i'll need it anyway. I'm in a pretty good range in the rear after fullly adjusting the stock spindle bolt. Before adjusting it i was over -2.2* in back on both sides.
@ Colorado-SHOBro Correct from the Ford Dealer. Z
I took my car with new tires to get aligned today. I included the camber bolts 81280. They didn't work. The lobe doesn't make contact on the inside of the hole. I went ahead and ordered the 84130. Hopefully it does the trick.
Quote from: GIGANTORE on November 25, 2017, 05:14:18 PM
I took my car with new tires to get aligned today. I included the camber bolts 81280. They didn't work. The lobe doesn't make contact on the inside of the hole. I went ahead and ordered the 84130. Hopefully it does the trick.
Any chance you can measure the bolts And post some pics ?
I took some pics of the 84130
In this thread just to compare.
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php?topic=8585.0
Quote from: glock-coma on November 27, 2017, 08:53:31 AM
Quote from: GIGANTORE on November 25, 2017, 05:14:18 PM
I took my car with new tires to get aligned today. I included the camber bolts 81280. They didn't work. The lobe doesn't make contact on the inside of the hole. I went ahead and ordered the 84130. Hopefully it does the trick.
Any chance you can measure the bolts And post some pics ?
I took some pics of the 84130
In this thread just to compare.
https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php?topic=8585.0 (https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.com/index.php?topic=8585.0)
I would if I could find my calipers
Got the 84130 in the mail. Look at the length difference. Also, the cammed lobe is much longer in the 84130.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171130/578908eb9ee10469f058443836a03a5d.jpg)
Quote from: GIGANTORE on November 30, 2017, 05:44:19 PM
Got the 84130 in the mail. Look at the length difference. Also, the cammed lobe is much longer in the 84130.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171130/578908eb9ee10469f058443836a03a5d.jpg)
My guy just install these and they worked beautifully.
They were definitely needed in my case.
Maybe I missed it in the thread... But was there a final good part number available for rear camber bolts for the 13+ MKS? Something obviously long enough and with enough adjustment for the H&R sport springs. Any direction, links is appreciated. Thanks
Quote from: StinkinLinkin13 on January 22, 2018, 02:54:19 PM
Maybe I missed it in the thread... But was there a final good part number available for rear camber bolts for the 13+ MKS? Something obviously long enough and with enough adjustment for the H&R sport springs. Any direction, links is appreciated. Thanks
SPC84130 are the correct length for SHO/MKS applications.
Thanks man. At almost 25 per bolt just wanted to be sure it was the right set for the 13 MKS. 👍
I used the 84130 and they fit perfectly.
Thanks guys. Any recommended vendors? Amazon seems to be the cheapest so far.
Quote from: StinkinLinkin13 on January 23, 2018, 11:27:59 AM
Thanks guys. Any recommended vendors? Amazon seems to be the cheapest so far.
Amazon was the cheapest I could find also.
Any idea why the right side numbers are different from the left side alignment numbers? In the past, my alignments always strived to have the same amount of camber on the left and right.
Thanks,
It is most likely to compensate for driver weight. If you've ever sat in a car while its on the alignment rack you would see all the measurements change in real time on the display. Unfortunately I've seen guys use pry bars or even just pull the wheels outward to get alignments into the "green" save and print it to satisfy the customer with that green spec printout.
I know this is an old post, but wondering if anyone has used the Moog K100383 bolt. Looks to be equivalent specs to the wider one from SPC at almost 1/2 the price. I plan to get a pair on my next order from Summit with some springs.
Quote from: timbo on July 06, 2019, 04:09:37 PM
I know this is an old post, but wondering if anyone has used the Moog K100383 bolt. Looks to be equivalent specs to the wider one from SPC at almost 1/2 the price. I plan to get a pair on my next order from Summit with some springs.
Looks like a viable solution. Only one way to find out fo sho.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190706/bb482ceee68e0fd45ce2044d76f40899.jpg)