For black Friday, I picked up a Gearhead Automotive Performance tune; SCT x4 and GH gapped plugs. I also got a 3 bar from Rock Auto.
12/18- My plan was to install all at the same time, however several weeks later and I just could not be patient anymore. So in about 30min I had everything but the plugs done. A few road trips later and my impressions are this: not much noticeable difference. First and second gear appear to be more aggressive, firmer shifts, and even though I question it myself- the exhaust note sounds better.
Up until the tune, OAR had been -1.0000 for over year (93 plus ACES IV). Since the tune, its slowly crept up, and is currently sitting at -0.3828. Most of the drives shows timing at +40, but there are times when its retarded a few degrees. I think both of these are due to using stock plugs, but could also be changes caused by the tune's usage of OAR (GH specifies that they improve the auto octane adjustment feature, but I dont know much more detail).
12/30- I have changed the plugs and scoped each cylinder. I'll keep using the torque app to see if there is any improvement. Using this cylinder order, all of the plugs and tops of the pistons looked good. I could see the 'thumb print' in great detail on every piston. Car has 37,6xx miles
Firewall
1 2 3
4 5 6
Bumper
#2 I could actually see a QR code and other (model number or something) markings.
#1 and #3 were the 'worst'. Those two have slight amounts of carbon build up, mostly in the center indentation around the 'thumb print'.
4-6 were almost as clean as 2, though the position of the pistons prevented me from seeing any markings. Tops of pistons looked good.
I did notice I have what appears to be leaking around the HPFP. Is this normal, and easy to fix. This concerns me some, but I hope its an easy fix using a seal or gasket.
Hopefully this fixes any timing retard. I'm less concerned with OAR at this point, though since its increased after so long with it glued to the max value, I'd simply like to know what is causing the increase. A part of me also thinks that because of the increase is OAR value, I'm leaving performance on the table... and I dont want to do that :)
I'm also lining up a dyno session to see if I get numbers that mimic GH's advertised 335hp/415tq. I really hope I reach those numbers and my general impression of "not much noticeable difference" would be very welcomed as in my mind that would mean the tune has kept the stock drive-ability but actually added performance. As far as cylinders 1 and 3 go, I guess my options are: catch can; meth; or BG/ walnut blasting. I'll give it some time and take a look at the intake manifold before I make a final determination, since these are just barely showing signs of build up. My foremost concern is the gunk around the HPFP, and fixing any potential leak.
Priority is finding the source of the leak!! Pic's please of the HPFP area in question!!
Fuel smell of any kind?
Did you happen to check for any codes set?
Here's a dedicated Install Video on the HPFP! Z
http://youtu.be/eqnewM691Fs (http://youtu.be/eqnewM691Fs)
The only issue I have seen mentioned is the brazing slag in the fuel line causing clogging at the HPFP. Since you see a leak, I am sure there is a gasket AND an O-ring you could swap out, similar to what is available for the F150.
Thanks guys, I'll take a closer look at the HPFP and report back.
Are cylinders 1 and 3 typically the problem ones for carbon build up? Or is it more sporadic and just happens to be those two in my case. Again, they aren't bad, just comparatively to the other 4 are the ones showing signs of build up.
I am also in discussions with a local shop for some Dyno pulls. It's just coming down to scheduling. I know there is a file Torrie sends for data logging, but I'm not tuned by him. I can use X4 or Torque, but what parameters should I look to capture during the pulls?
Overall I'm satisfied with the car at 37k. And if the tune puts out what it's supposed to I'll be really happy.
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Quote from: J-Will on December 31, 2017, 09:01:25 AM
I am also in discussions with a local shop for some Dyno pulls. It's just coming down to scheduling. I know there is a file Torrie sends for data logging, but I'm not tuned by him. I can use X4 or Torque, but what parameters should I look to capture during the pulls?
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Pm me your email..I think I may have it but not sure. I can email you the config that I generally use. It depends on what you want to see..But here is a list:
Measured AFR bank 1
Measured AFR bank 2 if applicable
Lambse bank 1
Lambse bank 2 if applicable
IAT2-intake air temp2 in farenheit
CAC intercooler temp
MAP in kpa
Desired TIP
Throttle angle actual
Spark V2 in degrees
Torque source
Turbo Wastegate percentage
Vehicle speed
RPM
Ambient temp in F
MAP sensor voltage
Coolant cylinder head temp in F
STFT bank 1
STFT bank 2 if applicable
Gear commanded
Fuel rail pressure psi
Fuel rear pressure
Load
Load absolute
Knock sensor
Gear commanded
Fuel rail pressure OBD PID in PSI
frp mpa dsd
Octane Adjust Ratio
LTFT bank 1
Torque converter speed ratio
OSS-output shaft speed
total misfires
I think you will put down the advertised power numbers. Sometimes when a tune is super smooth it makes it feel less aggressive but do you really want to go fast or just feel like you are going fast?
What plugs did you end up installing?
I wouldn't worry about the changing OAR...It's all in the name of safety.
Quote from: AJP turbo on December 31, 2017, 10:45:05 AM
I think you will put down the advertised power numbers. Sometimes when a tune is super smooth it makes it feel less aggressive but do you really want to go fast or just feel like you are going fast?
What plugs did you end up installing?
I wouldn't worry about the changing OAR...It's all in the name of safety.
PM sent, and thank you.
I agree with this reply wholeheartedly and is exactly what I'm shooting for with the tune. I also hope that came across in my initial post. Plugs are SP-542 (CYFS-092-YPT), bought pre-gapped from GH.
Also I wouldn't get overly caught up with OAR....If the tune was stock then ideally you want it to be at -1
But on a tune OAR can be manipulated many different ways...Some tuners may use it and some may not make adjustments...And when I say manipulate it I don't meant cheat it or force it to read a certain way...
I could over advance the spark and make the OAR read 0 because the ECU dialed back the spark curve because I over advanced the tables but in the end you are producing the same spark levels as another person that has an OAR value of -1 but we are conditioned to think that -1 is better...It's all about what is going on in the tune
To me the OAR value is more like a Long term fuel trim but for spark...It represents the trend in what is going on with spark and Learned fuel octane.
And the Octane adjust learned values can be sped up for sensitivity, but I won't speculate as to what exactly is going on in your tune...But Gearhead makes great tunes with great detail so you are in good hands.
Filled up the the tank yesterday (93) and didnt have ACES with me. OAR dropped to -0.27
ACES has since been added, and I will continue to monitor but expect OAR to go back up. Needless to say, I'm a fan of ACES.
Still looking to get some dyno pulls and logs
I made it down to Fredericksburg yesterday to put the SHO on a Dynocom DC 7500. She made 317 hp /340 tq. I am satisfied with the numbers as long as the logs indicate the car's running well, though I will mention that 340 falls pretty far from the GH advertised 415
I attached logs and the combined graph.
There are many factors that could've played into your numbers. But I have no doubt that the logs will indicate that your car is running well and healthy
You are in good hands and I know you have a safe and more complete tune than many others that run some other brand of tunes and I'm not talking about LMS.
Do you race? Maybe one day you can see what it will do at the track
Was this a Dynojet? An AWD machine? If not the numbers, oft quoted based on Dynojets, could easily be understated.
Quote from: J-Will on January 11, 2018, 06:27:09 PM
I made it down to Fredericksburg yesterday to put the SHO on a Dynocom DC 7500. She made 317 hp /340 tq. I am satisfied with the numbers as long as the logs indicate the car's running well, though I will mention that 340 falls pretty far from the GH advertised 415
I attached logs and the combined graph.
Pull 2 looks like the very end of a pull...
Just got off the phone with Matt, we had a great conversation. He's not happy with the power, and says its just a little over stock. OAR is indicating crappy gas, and the car is responding as it should to keep everything at a safe level. His tune makes OAR a little more sensitive versus the stock usage of OAR. I'm definitely leaving power on the table, but am limited by gas. I believe this is the switch to winter gas. There is the possibility that the gas station ripped me off, but I cant worry about that now.
After our conversation, I like this tune even more. Which is difficult to say, when the car is effectively at stock power levels. While offered, I do not think I'm going to take Matt up on making adjustments to the tune for the purposes of increased power. The goal here is to keep the car within safe ranges, and I like that the tune is pulling timing and lowering boost to keep it safe automatically. Cant wait for it to automatically add timing and boost :)
For now, I have no choice but to ride out the winter gas here in the area. I'm going to play with some gas over the next few weeks and see if the OAR continues to go lower. I am going to report back to Matt just to make sure that the car is doing what is intended. If the 93 I put in it is acting like 88 (or whatever octane brings the OAR to the level its at right now), then what would 89 or even worse 87 do? That said, when I see OAR return to a more acceptable level I will throw the SHO back on the dyno (tell me you didnt read that like this: thr-OH the S.H.-OH back on the dyn-OH).
Quote from: J-Will on January 12, 2018, 10:19:51 AM
Just got off the phone with Matt, we had a great conversation. He's not happy with the power, and says its just a little over stock. OAR is indicating crappy gas, and the car is responding as it should to keep everything at a safe level. His tune makes OAR a little more sensitive versus the stock usage of OAR. I'm definitely leaving power on the table, but am limited by gas. I believe this is the switch to winter gas. There is the possibility that the gas station ripped me off, but I cant worry about that now.
After our conversation, I like this tune even more. Which is difficult to say, when the car is effectively at stock power levels. While offered, I do not think I'm going to take Matt up on making adjustments to the tune for the purposes of increased power. The goal here is to keep the car within safe ranges, and I like that the tune is pulling timing and lowering boost to keep it safe automatically. Cant wait for it to automatically add timing and boost :)
For now, I have no choice but to ride out the winter gas here in the area. I'm going to play with some gas over the next few weeks and see if the OAR continues to go lower. I am going to report back to Matt just to make sure that the car is doing what is intended. If the 93 I put in it is acting like 88 (or whatever octane brings the OAR to the level its at right now), then what would 89 or even worse 87 do? That said, when I see OAR return to a more acceptable level I will throw the SHO back on the dyno (tell me you didnt read that like this: thr-OH the S.H.-OH back on the dyn-OH).
J-Will,
Great to hear you are getting good response and service from your tuner. That is really the core of any Tuner/client relationship above and beyond the quality of the tune. Matt and Brad are just those sort of guys.
I fully understand not wanting to push it with winter gas. Maybe touch base with Matt and see if he would be willing to adjust some once the fuel gets better come springtime, since he and you know that the tune is not where he expected due to fuel right now.
Quote from: lamrith on January 12, 2018, 01:50:51 PM
Quote from: J-Will on January 12, 2018, 10:19:51 AM
Just got off the phone with Matt, we had a great conversation. He's not happy with the power, and says its just a little over stock. OAR is indicating crappy gas, and the car is responding as it should to keep everything at a safe level. His tune makes OAR a little more sensitive versus the stock usage of OAR. I'm definitely leaving power on the table, but am limited by gas. I believe this is the switch to winter gas. There is the possibility that the gas station ripped me off, but I cant worry about that now.
After our conversation, I like this tune even more. Which is difficult to say, when the car is effectively at stock power levels. While offered, I do not think I'm going to take Matt up on making adjustments to the tune for the purposes of increased power. The goal here is to keep the car within safe ranges, and I like that the tune is pulling timing and lowering boost to keep it safe automatically. Cant wait for it to automatically add timing and boost :)
For now, I have no choice but to ride out the winter gas here in the area. I'm going to play with some gas over the next few weeks and see if the OAR continues to go lower. I am going to report back to Matt just to make sure that the car is doing what is intended. If the 93 I put in it is acting like 88 (or whatever octane brings the OAR to the level its at right now), then what would 89 or even worse 87 do? That said, when I see OAR return to a more acceptable level I will throw the SHO back on the dyno (tell me you didnt read that like this: thr-OH the S.H.-OH back on the dyn-OH).
J-Will,
Great to hear you are getting good response and service from your tuner. That is really the core of any Tuner/client relationship above and beyond the quality of the tune. Matt and Brad are just those sort of guys.
I fully understand not wanting to push it with winter gas. Maybe touch base with Matt and see if he would be willing to adjust some once the fuel gets better come springtime, since he and you know that the tune is not where he expected due to fuel right now.
I idea with the GH tune is that it'll auto adjust once it gets the gas it likes. Right now, its auto adjusting down. We will see if that is indeed the case when I see an uptick in the OAR
Take a look at your KR values in your logs as well. And if you haven't already, check the knock sensor wires for chafing. If you have E85 available, try and add a few gallons to your next tank, as it will raise your octane level. Those two things can help to raise the OAR/confirm it is gas.
The Knock sensors wire chafing would lead to OAR closer to 0, due to false knock readings. This would have nothing to do with your gas, and would persist with non-winter blends.
Adding E85 would ideally bring your OAR closer to -1 from where it is now. If this happened, then you would know more definitively that gas is to blame here.
Winter gas sucks. That said, my OAR only ever got as bad as -.76 when I had my E20 Tune from AJP. There were points in winter when it was below freezing out, and I had -1 OAR and > 20 degrees of spark advance. I only ever ran Shell 93 (which is an E10 blend) and then got E85 where I could. ~3 gallons of E85 to the rest of the tank of Shell 93 V-power.
OH, also, the colder it is, the more fuel you need to get up and running until the car is warmed, and in some cases over all. AJP and I went back and forth with some datalogs the first winter I was tuned, and fattened up my fueling a bit. In the winter it kept me running as close to commanded/stoich as we could get. In the warmer weather this tune ran a little fat/rich but that added some slight safety.
Winter gas!!! Blahhh I run my e30 tune all year round with no issues... thanks Brad!!
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Yes, good points derf.
KR caused the ecu to pull timing. All probably impacted from the crappy gas. I will take a look at the sensor and wires, that's a good idea just to make sure.
You'll see the boost and timing advance isn't really high also.
The car is doing what it's supposed to do and automatically decreasing the map, in this case to essentially use the stock one.
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Quote from: J-Will on January 12, 2018, 07:46:20 PM
Yes, good points derf.
KR caused the ecu to pull timing. All probably impacted from the crappy gas. I will take a look at the sensor and wires, that's a good idea just to make sure.
You'll see the boost and timing advance isn't really high also.
The car is doing what it's supposed to do and automatically decreasing the map, in this case to essentially use the stock one.
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If you don't want to wait for summer blends to be back, and have access to E85, I still would suggest adding a few gallons to your next fill up. If OAR starts to go back towards -1 with E85 in the tank, then you know its mainly a gas issue.
filled the tank with a little bit of regular, no ACES, and the OAR has plummeted to -0.0607 after just a few miles. I doubt its finished its path toward positive 1. While this doesnt rule out anything like bad knock sensors, it strongly points toward the fuel.
Do other Tunes/Tuners have this problem ?
Quote from: Macgyver on January 25, 2018, 06:49:47 PM
Do other Tunes/Tuners have this problem ?
Just to be clear, right now the operating theory is that I'm dealing with crappy winter fuel.
If that is the case, then yes other tuners would have the same problem. However, Gearhead's tune auto adjusts. Right now, it's decreasing power back down to stock levels. Better gas will increase power.
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Oh yeah I get that but no one else is saying their car is running this way using Unleashed LMS AJP BCB etc.
Quote from: Macgyver on January 25, 2018, 07:52:43 PM
Oh yeah I get that but no one else is saying their car is running this way using Unleashed LMS AJP BCB etc.
Those tunes are single octane purpose built. Those also require data logging, revisions and fine tuning (LMS being the exception).
The gearhead tune auto adjusts and requires no data logging. I'm bringing my experience to the table because of this unique feature. It's working as intended, unfortunately for me the fuel is causing the tune to load stock parameters.
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I came across the gasket for the HPFP while searching on the New Ford Site! Z :)
Sorry for the later reply!
Gasket
Part #: CG781 (9417)
Fuel Injection Pump-Engine Mounted
(https://i.imgur.com/c8R5kVMm.jpg)
https://parts.ford.com/shop/en/us/fuel-injection-and-pumps/gasket-6551899-1
Thanks! For that low of a price I may just start with replacing the gasket.
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https://www.fordpartsgiant.com/parts-list/2013-ford-taurus/fuel-injection-pump-engine-mounted.html?Filter=(38591;30734;43021)&PNC=9350 (https://www.fordpartsgiant.com/parts-list/2013-ford-taurus/fuel-injection-pump-engine-mounted.html?Filter=(38591;30734;43021)&PNC=9350)
AA5Z-9417-A
Quote from: SHOdded on February 01, 2018, 02:48:05 AM
https://www.fordpartsgiant.com/parts-list/2013-ford-taurus/fuel-injection-pump-engine-mounted.html?Filter=(38591;30734;43021)&PNC=9350 (https://www.fordpartsgiant.com/parts-list/2013-ford-taurus/fuel-injection-pump-engine-mounted.html?Filter=(38591;30734;43021)&PNC=9350)
AA5Z-9417-A
Nice find! Manu is the Master on pricing! Z :)
I took my car in for its normal maintenance routine, and took the necessary precaution of removing the 3 bar and putting the stock tune back on. OAR shot to |1|. Once I got the car back home, I put the 3 bar and Gearhead tune back on, and over the course of several days watched the OAR continue to move closer to 0.
This week we may have some good news to share. OAR is slowly progressing toward |1| again. I will wait for it to sustain better than |.8|, as that should be the mapping for max boost. Then it'll be back to the dyno!
I have no addressed the HPFP yet. I think that'll be a project I'll tackle soon though. I hope its just the gasket, though I do think Gearhead is working on supporting (or already does support) the after market HPFPs
Any update on your tune and impressions?
No actual update to the time itself, still running the same one. It had to be the winter fuel issue. The car is quicker, and gets better gas mileage.
Trying to get it back on the Dyno for verification but nothing scheduled yet.
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Any updates on your fuel situation ?
The fuel was the problem. The tune automatically adjusted as intended. Once better fuel was used the OAR was pegged at -1 and timing increased.
Glad I chose this tune, it seemed to work great. Only one I used.
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What is the "better fuel" in use?
Just 93 pump but simoly 'not winter fuel'.
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