• Welcome to Ecoboost Performance Forum. Please log in or sign up.
collapse

Why not straight E85?

Started by StinkinLinkin13, December 12, 2018, 01:20:16 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

SM105K

Quote from: 802SHO on December 19, 2018, 12:51:50 PM
Quote from: sm105k on December 19, 2018, 12:35:26 PM
Quote from: 802SHO on December 19, 2018, 04:47:18 AM
Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two?

I know some of my turbo LS guys run E85 and Meth.  They are both alcohol based fuels that work well together.

Brad was on here earlier I was hoping he would chime in.  So yes I'm assuming if an E30 tune is better by the seat of the pants dyno 93 tune...and meth is better than 93 only...wouldnt an E30 Meth tune be better?  Old rule that more is better I'm hoping applies here.....

I am willing to bet it is better.
"M" 2013 SHO PP | AJPTurbo E30 Tune | FS HPFP | Stock IC with Ice Water DIY Sprayer | PPE Downpipes | Custom Magnaflow Resonator | 3rd Cat Delete | Derale Upgraded Trans Cooler | Dicunzolo Gen2 Trans Mounts| EPP Noisemaker Eliminator | MSD Coil Over Plugs | SP-542's | UPR Dual Valve Catch Can | K&N Drop In | Power Stop Slotted and Drilled Rotors with Stock PP Pads | H&R Springs  | AVS Flush Deflector | 802SHO Custom Splitter | Duraflex Chin Spoiler | Curva Concept C7's | Continental DWS06 Extreme Contact Rubber | 411 HP and 546 TQ |

"The Fukus" 2013 Focus ST | Boomba BOV | FSWerks Short Shifter | Power Stop Brakes | Continental DWS06 Extreme Contact Rubber |

Warriormonx

Quote from: sm105k on December 19, 2018, 01:19:56 PM
Quote from: 802SHO on December 19, 2018, 12:51:50 PM
Quote from: sm105k on December 19, 2018, 12:35:26 PM
Quote from: 802SHO on December 19, 2018, 04:47:18 AM
Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two?

I know some of my turbo LS guys run E85 and Meth.  They are both alcohol based fuels that work well together.

Brad was on here earlier I was hoping he would chime in.  So yes I'm assuming if an E30 tune is better by the seat of the pants dyno 93 tune...and meth is better than 93 only...wouldnt an E30 Meth tune be better?  Old rule that more is better I'm hoping applies here.....

I am willing to bet it is better.
My tuner certainly recommended the e30 + meth or straight e85 rather than e85 + meth


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

802SHO

Quote from: Warriormonx on December 19, 2018, 01:21:18 PM
Quote from: sm105k on December 19, 2018, 01:19:56 PM
Quote from: 802SHO on December 19, 2018, 12:51:50 PM
Quote from: sm105k on December 19, 2018, 12:35:26 PM
Quote from: 802SHO on December 19, 2018, 04:47:18 AM
Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two?

I know some of my turbo LS guys run E85 and Meth.  They are both alcohol based fuels that work well together.

Brad was on here earlier I was hoping he would chime in.  So yes I'm assuming if an E30 tune is better by the seat of the pants dyno 93 tune...and meth is better than 93 only...wouldnt an E30 Meth tune be better?  Old rule that more is better I'm hoping applies here.....

I am willing to bet it is better.
My tuner certainly recommended the e30 + meth or straight e85 rather than e85 + meth


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Straight E85 instead of E85+Meth?  I wonder why?
IG @802SHO 2010 SHO non PP, Tuned by AJP Turbo, 109 Octane + VP C85 for E30, Ported GH Gen 3 upgraded turbos, Ported 13+ Exhaust Manifolds, Custom FM IC TreadStone TR10C, EPP Hot Pipes, EPP Dual CAI, XDI35 HPFP, Deatschwerks 300C LPFP, Alky Control Methonal Injection, Alky dual nozzle upgrade, Zex Nitrous dual dry shots, Dicunzolo Gen2 torque mounts, MSD Coils, SP542 .026, 160 T, 3bar, Phenolic Spacer, Braille Lightweight Battery, Kirky Lightweight Racing Driver Seat, Catless Downpipes, custom stainless 2.5" double xpipe w/muffler deletes 4" quad tips, UPR Dual Valve Catch Can, 13+ PP Trans Cooler, Econoaid throttle Body Booster, Bravado Tribute 20x9.5 + 32 offset Wheels, Nitto NT555R Front Tires, Continental Extreme Contact DW Rear Tires and all are 275/35/20, H&R Springs all around w/rear cut 1/2", 1" hubcentric wheel spacers m14 1.5 stud/lug conversion, R1 Concepts Geomet slotted/drilled rotors with Heavy Duty Semi Metallic pads, Aeroforce Interceptor Gauge.
Currently World's Fastest Ecoboost SHO
11.063 @ 123.17 MPH!  NED 10/10/20

Warriormonx

Quote from: 802SHO on December 19, 2018, 01:57:41 PM
Quote from: Warriormonx on December 19, 2018, 01:21:18 PM
Quote from: sm105k on December 19, 2018, 01:19:56 PM
Quote from: 802SHO on December 19, 2018, 12:51:50 PM
Quote from: sm105k on December 19, 2018, 12:35:26 PM
Quote from: 802SHO on December 19, 2018, 04:47:18 AM
Pardon me if this is off topic but is anyone currently running an E30 blend with Meth or is anyone on here running straight E85 on meth?  I know Livernois mentioned they have at least one customer that is.  Curious if they are a member here.  Anyway, what could be gained by combining the two?

I know some of my turbo LS guys run E85 and Meth.  They are both alcohol based fuels that work well together.

Brad was on here earlier I was hoping he would chime in.  So yes I'm assuming if an E30 tune is better by the seat of the pants dyno 93 tune...and meth is better than 93 only...wouldnt an E30 Meth tune be better?  Old rule that more is better I'm hoping applies here.....

I am willing to bet it is better.
My tuner certainly recommended the e30 + meth or straight e85 rather than e85 + meth


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Straight E85 instead of E85+Meth?  I wonder why?
I didn't push it - he can be a little prickly. I would imagine that the complexity of ECU controls to achieve a balance between meth and the aux rail / injectors might be a little risky?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

802SHO

Sounds very complex for a tuner thats for sure.  What would be any pros or cons running a blend like E30 with Meth?  StealBlueSHO where are you?
IG @802SHO 2010 SHO non PP, Tuned by AJP Turbo, 109 Octane + VP C85 for E30, Ported GH Gen 3 upgraded turbos, Ported 13+ Exhaust Manifolds, Custom FM IC TreadStone TR10C, EPP Hot Pipes, EPP Dual CAI, XDI35 HPFP, Deatschwerks 300C LPFP, Alky Control Methonal Injection, Alky dual nozzle upgrade, Zex Nitrous dual dry shots, Dicunzolo Gen2 torque mounts, MSD Coils, SP542 .026, 160 T, 3bar, Phenolic Spacer, Braille Lightweight Battery, Kirky Lightweight Racing Driver Seat, Catless Downpipes, custom stainless 2.5" double xpipe w/muffler deletes 4" quad tips, UPR Dual Valve Catch Can, 13+ PP Trans Cooler, Econoaid throttle Body Booster, Bravado Tribute 20x9.5 + 32 offset Wheels, Nitto NT555R Front Tires, Continental Extreme Contact DW Rear Tires and all are 275/35/20, H&R Springs all around w/rear cut 1/2", 1" hubcentric wheel spacers m14 1.5 stud/lug conversion, R1 Concepts Geomet slotted/drilled rotors with Heavy Duty Semi Metallic pads, Aeroforce Interceptor Gauge.
Currently World's Fastest Ecoboost SHO
11.063 @ 123.17 MPH!  NED 10/10/20

Warriormonx

Quote from: 802SHO on December 19, 2018, 02:46:52 PM
Sounds very complex for a tuner thats for sure.  What would be any pros or cons running a blend like E30 with Meth?  StealBlueSHO where are you?
Personally, I love the idea of meth. Great for warmer climates to really reduce intake temps - that and you get a steam clean for your cylinders. Awesome. Add higher octane fuel with e30 and I reckon the RS would be really happy.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

StealBlueSho

It's easy really...

E85 effective octane rating and knock resistance makes as good as race gas. And it cools the cylinder charge quite a bit based on a studies. You can get A LOT of power out of E85. And it's simple if you can run it. Fill and go. Heat isn't a big deal from what I know.

E30 gets you close but not quite there. You can push more power than our motors can take with E30. But you need to monitor the mixes etc... and your still running into heat issues so a lot of tuners don't like turning it upto 11 without a way to control the heat.

E30 + meth allows you to get the advantages of E85 plus the cooling of meth. This is more beneficial so you can run higher boost/timing allowed by the E30 and get the cooling of meth...the advantage is you are not leaning on the meth to keep knock away, you can use it more for cooling.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

802SHO

Quote from: StealBlueSho on December 20, 2018, 06:02:28 AM
It's easy really...

E85 effective octane rating and knock resistance makes as good as race gas. And it cools the cylinder charge quite a bit based on a studies. You can get A LOT of power out of E85. And it's simple if you can run it. Fill and go. Heat isn't a big deal from what I know.

E30 gets you close but not quite there. You can push more power than our motors can take with E30. But you need to monitor the mixes etc... and your still running into heat issues so a lot of tuners don't like turning it upto 11 without a way to control the heat.

E30 + meth allows you to get the advantages of E85 plus the cooling of meth. This is more beneficial so you can run higher boost/timing allowed by the E30 and get the cooling of meth...the advantage is you are not leaning on the meth to keep knock away, you can use it more for cooling.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So basically if I can get the mix down, this would be an excellent fuel set up.  I think I know what I'll be doing next.  Thank you kind Sir for your input. 
IG @802SHO 2010 SHO non PP, Tuned by AJP Turbo, 109 Octane + VP C85 for E30, Ported GH Gen 3 upgraded turbos, Ported 13+ Exhaust Manifolds, Custom FM IC TreadStone TR10C, EPP Hot Pipes, EPP Dual CAI, XDI35 HPFP, Deatschwerks 300C LPFP, Alky Control Methonal Injection, Alky dual nozzle upgrade, Zex Nitrous dual dry shots, Dicunzolo Gen2 torque mounts, MSD Coils, SP542 .026, 160 T, 3bar, Phenolic Spacer, Braille Lightweight Battery, Kirky Lightweight Racing Driver Seat, Catless Downpipes, custom stainless 2.5" double xpipe w/muffler deletes 4" quad tips, UPR Dual Valve Catch Can, 13+ PP Trans Cooler, Econoaid throttle Body Booster, Bravado Tribute 20x9.5 + 32 offset Wheels, Nitto NT555R Front Tires, Continental Extreme Contact DW Rear Tires and all are 275/35/20, H&R Springs all around w/rear cut 1/2", 1" hubcentric wheel spacers m14 1.5 stud/lug conversion, R1 Concepts Geomet slotted/drilled rotors with Heavy Duty Semi Metallic pads, Aeroforce Interceptor Gauge.
Currently World's Fastest Ecoboost SHO
11.063 @ 123.17 MPH!  NED 10/10/20

802SHO

A barrel of pure E85 isn't too expensive.  I could mix that with 93 and do my own testing for E30. 
IG @802SHO 2010 SHO non PP, Tuned by AJP Turbo, 109 Octane + VP C85 for E30, Ported GH Gen 3 upgraded turbos, Ported 13+ Exhaust Manifolds, Custom FM IC TreadStone TR10C, EPP Hot Pipes, EPP Dual CAI, XDI35 HPFP, Deatschwerks 300C LPFP, Alky Control Methonal Injection, Alky dual nozzle upgrade, Zex Nitrous dual dry shots, Dicunzolo Gen2 torque mounts, MSD Coils, SP542 .026, 160 T, 3bar, Phenolic Spacer, Braille Lightweight Battery, Kirky Lightweight Racing Driver Seat, Catless Downpipes, custom stainless 2.5" double xpipe w/muffler deletes 4" quad tips, UPR Dual Valve Catch Can, 13+ PP Trans Cooler, Econoaid throttle Body Booster, Bravado Tribute 20x9.5 + 32 offset Wheels, Nitto NT555R Front Tires, Continental Extreme Contact DW Rear Tires and all are 275/35/20, H&R Springs all around w/rear cut 1/2", 1" hubcentric wheel spacers m14 1.5 stud/lug conversion, R1 Concepts Geomet slotted/drilled rotors with Heavy Duty Semi Metallic pads, Aeroforce Interceptor Gauge.
Currently World's Fastest Ecoboost SHO
11.063 @ 123.17 MPH!  NED 10/10/20

SHOdded

Storage is the problem, just like with methanol.  As long as you are familiar with it, good to go.
2007 Ford Edge SEL, Powerstop F/R Brake Kit, TXT LED 6000K Lo & Hi Beams, W16W LED Reverse Bulbs, 3BSpec 2.5w Map Lights, 5W Cree rear dome lights, 5W Cree cargo light, DTBL LED Taillights

If tuned:  Take note of the strategy code as you return to stock (including 3 bar MAP to 2 bar MAP) -> take car in & get it serviced -> check strategy code when you get car back -> have tuner update your tune if the strategy code has changed -> reload tune -> ENJOY!

StealBlueSho

Quote from: SHOdded on December 20, 2018, 08:31:23 AM
Storage is the problem, just like with methanol.  As long as you are familiar with it, good to go.

Exactly... alcohol attracts water. That's the problem with long term storage of those products.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ZSHO

#101
Quote from: StealBlueSho on December 20, 2018, 08:36:08 AM
Quote from: SHOdded on December 20, 2018, 08:31:23 AM
Storage is the problem, just like with methanol.  As long as you are familiar with it, good to go.

Exactly... alcohol attracts water. That's the problem with long term storage of those products.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
In some cases a Bit of Fuel stabilizer might help! I think VP recommends to add a bit for long term storage IIRC.  Z 


2013 Performance Package SHO| Livernois Custom Methanol Tune|3-Bar Map|Reische-170-Stat|Full Race Tial-10psi BOV in Black|PPE-Gloss Black Hot Pipes|EPP Dual Intake in Gloss Black|PPE Catted DP|Corsa Sport Cat Back Exhaust|H&R Sport-Springs|CFM Performance Billet Valve Cover Breather In Gloss Black|Llumar 20%Ceramic window Tint|MSD Ignition Coils in Black|Extreme Roof Spoiler|Redline Fluids all around|Gearhead Intercooler|First-SHO With Direct Port Alky-VP-M1-100%-Methanol Injection|LMS-Custom-Dyno-Tuned @ 415whp-465wtq| Best Trap Speed of 115.54 mph|

802SHO

Quote from: ZSHO on December 20, 2018, 08:45:47 AM
Quote from: StealBlueSho on December 20, 2018, 08:36:08 AM
Quote from: SHOdded on December 20, 2018, 08:31:23 AM
Storage is the problem, just like with methanol.  As long as you are familiar with it, good to go.

Exactly... alcohol attracts water. That's the problem with long term storage of those products.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
In some cases a Bit of Fuel stabilizer might help! I think VP recommends to add a bit for long term storage IIRC.  Z

My plan would be to purchase in the spring and use it up all summer into fall.  I'll put some stabilizer in it for the hell of it.
IG @802SHO 2010 SHO non PP, Tuned by AJP Turbo, 109 Octane + VP C85 for E30, Ported GH Gen 3 upgraded turbos, Ported 13+ Exhaust Manifolds, Custom FM IC TreadStone TR10C, EPP Hot Pipes, EPP Dual CAI, XDI35 HPFP, Deatschwerks 300C LPFP, Alky Control Methonal Injection, Alky dual nozzle upgrade, Zex Nitrous dual dry shots, Dicunzolo Gen2 torque mounts, MSD Coils, SP542 .026, 160 T, 3bar, Phenolic Spacer, Braille Lightweight Battery, Kirky Lightweight Racing Driver Seat, Catless Downpipes, custom stainless 2.5" double xpipe w/muffler deletes 4" quad tips, UPR Dual Valve Catch Can, 13+ PP Trans Cooler, Econoaid throttle Body Booster, Bravado Tribute 20x9.5 + 32 offset Wheels, Nitto NT555R Front Tires, Continental Extreme Contact DW Rear Tires and all are 275/35/20, H&R Springs all around w/rear cut 1/2", 1" hubcentric wheel spacers m14 1.5 stud/lug conversion, R1 Concepts Geomet slotted/drilled rotors with Heavy Duty Semi Metallic pads, Aeroforce Interceptor Gauge.
Currently World's Fastest Ecoboost SHO
11.063 @ 123.17 MPH!  NED 10/10/20

Warriormonx

Fortunate for us here in Australia there is a major retailer who has e85 on the bowser. Pretty solid ethanol content too. This reading was taken with around 5% 98 RON in the tank when I filled up.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

802SHO

Quote from: Warriormonx on December 20, 2018, 05:46:46 PM
Fortunate for us here in Australia there is a major retailer who has e85 on the bowser. Pretty solid ethanol content too. This reading was taken with around 5% 98 RON in the tank when I filled up.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's cool!  I'm a bit jealous, there is no E85 anywhere here in Vermont.  I think one 55 gal drum would last me all season though...I pretty much drive to the track and the gym with it..spring to fall. 
IG @802SHO 2010 SHO non PP, Tuned by AJP Turbo, 109 Octane + VP C85 for E30, Ported GH Gen 3 upgraded turbos, Ported 13+ Exhaust Manifolds, Custom FM IC TreadStone TR10C, EPP Hot Pipes, EPP Dual CAI, XDI35 HPFP, Deatschwerks 300C LPFP, Alky Control Methonal Injection, Alky dual nozzle upgrade, Zex Nitrous dual dry shots, Dicunzolo Gen2 torque mounts, MSD Coils, SP542 .026, 160 T, 3bar, Phenolic Spacer, Braille Lightweight Battery, Kirky Lightweight Racing Driver Seat, Catless Downpipes, custom stainless 2.5" double xpipe w/muffler deletes 4" quad tips, UPR Dual Valve Catch Can, 13+ PP Trans Cooler, Econoaid throttle Body Booster, Bravado Tribute 20x9.5 + 32 offset Wheels, Nitto NT555R Front Tires, Continental Extreme Contact DW Rear Tires and all are 275/35/20, H&R Springs all around w/rear cut 1/2", 1" hubcentric wheel spacers m14 1.5 stud/lug conversion, R1 Concepts Geomet slotted/drilled rotors with Heavy Duty Semi Metallic pads, Aeroforce Interceptor Gauge.
Currently World's Fastest Ecoboost SHO
11.063 @ 123.17 MPH!  NED 10/10/20