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new to the SHO, Having some issues now

Started by jay.denning73, June 10, 2018, 08:04:11 PM

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jay.denning73

Ok fella's,

  Let me pick your brain. I bought a 2015 SHO built by Auto-Motion in Louisville, KY. Mods include a single turbo upgrade, and meth kit. Other than that it is stock. It does have the 3 bar map sensor, and LMS exhaust, and custom tuned.

  After buying the car for a really good price, I called the builder and got some back history on the car. The original owner wanted a 500hp daily driver fun car. It made that. The builder told me it 502 on the dyno. not bad.

So since I have owned the car I have been chasing a misfire and other codes. So let me describe the build and whats going on. There are custom uppipes to a T4 flange, The 70mm Turbo is now where the battery was, the battery was relocated to the trunk. The down pipe is custom and connects to the LMS exhaust. Both upstream O2 sensors are located in the DP just beyond the the turbo. Each uppipe has its own waste gate and there is a blow off valve in there as well. There is an alky kit installed, with the controller in the glove box.

Now my problems are I constantly get a list of codes.
0020 Camshaft Position Sensor
0300 Random Misfire
0304
0305
0306
0131 O2 sensor
0152 O2 Sensor High Voltage Bank 2
2198 O2 sensor Bank 2 stuck rich

The weird thing is I can clear codes and drive it with no problems, other times it will misfire for miles upon miles. Even with the CEL on, I can start it take off no problems and then poof random misfires. I never know when it will occur. Take for instance I jumped in it Sat morning drove it 40 miles, never misfired or anything. Stopped for about 20 minutes, restarted the car and took off and blam, misfired for 10 miles, then just stopped and acted normal again. Drove it home no problems again.

Could this be caused by the both O2 sensors being in the Downpipe right next to each other? I changed plugs, oil and even moved CP around with the plug change and still have no luck. Any ideas would be great. I am thinking of dropping in a wideband O2 just to look at whats happening.

jay

StealBlueSho

Is it this car?




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StealBlueSho

Honestly I hate to tell you this...

But with all the modifications to get that to work including the tuning involved... troubleshooting this via a forum is going to be difficult at best...
Impossible most other times...

Just looking at that gives me heart burn...

Sounds like they cleared out the codes... prayed to god it test drove well... and sold it off...




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jay.denning73

Yep, Thats it. I love the car, when its on its on, but when its off its frustrating.

I dont have any local EcoBoost guys to turn to. This is a little advanced than my GN as well.

StealBlueSho

Sooo what I see via the codes...

All cylinders on bank 2 (the one by the fire wall) are misfiring or are having compression issues...

The P0020 issue is saying the cam positioning is off on bank 2... could be causing all the misfire issues on bank two...

And then the WB issue for the rest..

The WB bands should be positioned to capture the exhaust from each bank... so if they are positioned wrong the car is going to throw a fit... aka... both sensors on the same bank would not be a good idea for a lot of reasons... also sounds like it was wired incorrectly or not well when it was moved...

The cam position error COULD be the actuator... so it's not getting the timing feed back needed to adjust correctly could lead to all those issues with the P030X...

I had a P0020 error on my 2010 but was not bad enough to cause the other problems....


And then the tuning side of this needs to go to a reputable tuner WITH A SHOP... like LMS or Unleashed...

That is a project car... if you got it for a DD... I'm sorry...

I hope they didn't blow something trying to get it to run...




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StealBlueSho

Also for the tuning... that shop from what I know tuned that car... which no one of the forums, SHO community, or Facebook are familiar with.. which means as complicated as these cars are to tune... would be suspect to me...




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AJP turbo

Eee gads!...id almost consider tuning that for free but I fear it wouldn't end well...i would want to get the 02 sensors pre turbo near the manifolds but there are also inherent problems with that too but it's a compromise and generally better than having them that far downstream..

Problem with having the sensors that far away is the transport delay and the sensors cooling down..so the 02 heaters need tuned way up and the transport increased

Then you have the issue of wastegate duty cycle and boost control and the torque model
SCT Dealer/Custom Calibrator                        
Specializing in 3.5 Ecoboost   
Remote/email custom tuning including E85 blends 
Authorized retailer for all SCT devices. 
 
Former:2014 PP SHO
3 bar 93 tune, Airaid, Stainless Works non catted DP's  
405whp/520tq
Dyno
     
Current:2016 F150 2.7 Ecoboost
Tuning in progress

StealBlueSho

To the OP....

AJPTurbo is one of the MOST knowledgeable tuners I have ever worked with... and I have worked with ALMOST all of them.

I would give serious weight to what he says.


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AJP turbo

SCT Dealer/Custom Calibrator                        
Specializing in 3.5 Ecoboost   
Remote/email custom tuning including E85 blends 
Authorized retailer for all SCT devices. 
 
Former:2014 PP SHO
3 bar 93 tune, Airaid, Stainless Works non catted DP's  
405whp/520tq
Dyno
     
Current:2016 F150 2.7 Ecoboost
Tuning in progress

jay.denning73


All cylinders on bank 2 (the one by the fire wall) are misfiring or are having compression issues...
  *I thought this was the bank near the Radiator, good to know.

The P0020 issue is saying the cam positioning is off on bank 2... could be causing all the misfire issues on bank two...
   

And then the WB issue for the rest..
   WB= Wideband?

The WB bands should be positioned to capture the exhaust from each bank... so if they are positioned wrong the car is going to throw a fit... aka... both sensors on the same bank would not be a good idea for a lot of reasons... also sounds like it was wired incorrectly or not well when it was moved...
   * Both sensors are in the downpipe and right next to each other. The car is going to a shop next week to have the sensors moved to the respective uppipes so each is reading each bank. I had a Ford tech look over the car and that was his solution to start with. He thinks that may be causing all the problems. 

The cam position error COULD be the actuator... so it's not getting the timing feed back needed to adjust correctly could lead to all those issues with the P030X...

I had a P0020 error on my 2010 but was not bad enough to cause the other problems....


And then the tuning side of this needs to go to a reputable tuner WITH A SHOP... like LMS or Unleashed...
* I spoke with Kevin at Auto-Motion and he stated he works on the EcoBoost in the F150 platform and that the car was tuned on a dyno. Has over 200 pulls on it to get it where it is now.
The thing with the misfire is it is so random. I may drive the car one day and nothing. Jump in it the next and have it happen for 10 miles. I just never know.

That is a project car... if you got it for a DD... I'm sorry...
  This is a project/show car for me. I have a flex and edge I drive daily. This is a fun car for me. I got it at a good price price I think.

I hope they didn't blow something trying to get it to run...
  * I dont think so. Like I said when it is on, it doesnt miss a lick. Idles great, runs down the road, I can bury my foot in it, hit 15lbs of boost, alky comes on, its great. but those random times.

StealBlueSho

At least it's not a DD....


Good move getting the WBs corrected...

The timing is off on bank 2 would be my best guess... why... could be the actuator or tuning(?)... AJP would be the guy to answer if you can demand different timing on each bank or if that is a static component and you have a sensor/hardware issue...


And yes... it looks awesome!


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AJP turbo

The alky if being over sprayed which is common can also be causing misfires...there is just sooooo much going on with this...sometimes with all those codes it's hard to isolate a problem or problems
SCT Dealer/Custom Calibrator                        
Specializing in 3.5 Ecoboost   
Remote/email custom tuning including E85 blends 
Authorized retailer for all SCT devices. 
 
Former:2014 PP SHO
3 bar 93 tune, Airaid, Stainless Works non catted DP's  
405whp/520tq
Dyno
     
Current:2016 F150 2.7 Ecoboost
Tuning in progress

StealBlueSho

Oh! The relay that controls that bank 2 timing actuator runs under the battery... if that got damaged or melted by the turbo... there ya go...


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jay.denning73

Quote from: AJP turbo on June 10, 2018, 09:06:05 PM
The alky if being over sprayed which is common can also be causing misfires...there is just sooooo much going on with this...sometimes with all those codes it's hard to isolate a problem or problems

That doesnt seem to be an issue. It will misfire at idle and low boost b4 the alky system even comes on. It seems to come on around 7-10 lbs.

jay.denning73

Quote from: StealBlueSho on June 10, 2018, 09:06:31 PM
Oh! The relay that controls that bank 2 timing actuator runs under the battery... if that got damaged or melted by the turbo... there ya go...


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I will have the shop pull the turbo at the same time and look under it and the battery tray look for melted components!!

Thanks for that tidbit