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Author Topic: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine  (Read 11109 times)

Offline FearlessAZ

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #60 on: April 29, 2018, 11:17:54 AM »
I am almost positive that the filter couldn't have been that dirty.

But the misfire part lined up with the rest of the nonsense. And with the VTA, maybe that is what pulled the oil out?

I guess at this point, I just have to wait for Ford's word. I will be calling them tomorrow for an update.
2010 Non PP Sho. All the factory goodies. (RIP)


2015 MKS Ecoboost. All the factory goodies.

Offline FearlessAZ

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #61 on: May 25, 2018, 09:01:17 AM »
After a lot of back and forth with the dealership in TX, they want to ship the car out here because they can not find any exact cause. They also wan't me to pay for the shipping.

The dealership here in AZ can't own up to anything because the TX dealership just gives them a lot of maybes. Maybe it is this. Maybe it is that. Dealership can't do anything about maybes.

The way the dealership presented it to the warranty company was screw up. At the time, they told the warranty company they couldn't find a leak or a failed part so of course they will deny the claim because that is a dealership issue to cover.

Seems like every thing they presented falls back to the AZ dealership. First it was the charge pipe leaking form my BOVs, then they didn't think the right amount of oil was ever put in, then they claimed they thought the timing chain cover wasn't installed correctly. All point back to the dealership here. But all just maybes.
2010 Non PP Sho. All the factory goodies. (RIP)


2015 MKS Ecoboost. All the factory goodies.

Offline SHOdded

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #62 on: May 25, 2018, 09:21:59 AM »
Unless Ford is willing to work the dealership in AZ and provide assistance in your case, the only other option I see is lawyering up.  Even then, I think it will depend on the lawyer, not the documentation ... :(
2007 Ford Edge SEL, Powerstop F/R Brake Kit, TXT LED 6000K Lo & Hi Beams, W16W LED Reverse Bulbs, 3BSpec 2.5w Map Lights, 5W Cree rear dome lights, 5W Cree cargo light, DTBL LED Taillights

If tuned:  Take note of the strategy code as you return to stock (including 3 bar MAP to 2 bar MAP) -> take car in & get it serviced -> check strategy code when you get car back -> have tuner update your tune if the strategy code has changed -> reload tune -> ENJOY!

Offline FearlessAZ

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #63 on: December 05, 2018, 06:20:08 AM »
So after many months, final conclusion after the tear down is the dealership believes it to be a low fill scenario. They can't find an external leak to warrant that much of a loss and no signs of ingestion. The actual cause of the motor seizing was the turbo impellers basically began to melt and the engine main bearing became wasted due to the high heat and friction of no oil.


After so much back in forth with the dealership in Texas and them refusing to do a tear down, I was forced to have the car shipped back here to Phoenix to restart the whole process. The dealership here did the tear down and came to the conclusion above. They say it is the only thing that makes sense.

After talking with the GM here of the dealership that did all the work and the oil change, he says they will not claim any responsibility. He says there is no way I would have made it that far and anything could have happened between here and there.

Guess it is time to lawyer up.

Facts on the table are that I did make it that far and less than 24 hours after the oil change. No warning lights at all until I tried to restart the vehicle on the side of the road. After full tear down, no signs of a leak anywhere close to that big or any signs of ingestion.
2010 Non PP Sho. All the factory goodies. (RIP)


2015 MKS Ecoboost. All the factory goodies.

Offline SHOdded

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #64 on: December 05, 2018, 06:29:07 AM »
sorry to hear the offending dealership is not cooperating, but sometimes you have to take assistance from the means provided by law.  I hope you smack 'em down but good!  You are one patient dude!!!
2007 Ford Edge SEL, Powerstop F/R Brake Kit, TXT LED 6000K Lo & Hi Beams, W16W LED Reverse Bulbs, 3BSpec 2.5w Map Lights, 5W Cree rear dome lights, 5W Cree cargo light, DTBL LED Taillights

If tuned:  Take note of the strategy code as you return to stock (including 3 bar MAP to 2 bar MAP) -> take car in & get it serviced -> check strategy code when you get car back -> have tuner update your tune if the strategy code has changed -> reload tune -> ENJOY!

Offline ZSHO

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #65 on: December 05, 2018, 11:29:41 AM »
X2 sorry to hear about the mischief with this dealer especially with the holidays just around the corner. Best of luck and keep us updated. Z
« Last Edit: December 05, 2018, 03:26:17 PM by ZSHO »


2013 Performance Package SHO| Livernois Custom Methanol Tune|3-Bar Map|Reische-170-Stat|Full Race Tial-10psi BOV in Black|PPE-Gloss Black Hot Pipes|PPE Catted DP|Corsa Sport Cat Back Exhaust|H&R Sport-Springs|Airaid-Dry-flow-CAI|CFM Performance Billet Valve Cover Breather In Gloss Black|Llumar 20%Ceramic window Tint|MSD Ignition Coils in Black|Extreme Roof Spoiler|Redline Fluids all around|First-SHO With Direct Port Alky-VP-M1-100%-Methanol Injection|LMS-Custom-Dyno-Tuned @ 415whp-465wtq| Best Trap Speed of 115.54 mph|

Offline FearlessAZ

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #66 on: December 10, 2018, 09:22:26 AM »
The one thing I constantly hear from these techs and managers is it wouldn't make it that far on a quart of oil and how come the oil didnt come on. I have absolutely no answers to these.

Is the light an oil pressure or level light? It didn't come on until we were already on the side of the road and about to try and turn it back on.

I can't even begin to explain how it made it that far. I have heard when they do oil changes, there is roughly a quart still inside everything unless flushed. With a good synthetic and a couple quarts, I could believe it made it that far with the same result of stuff getting hot enough to cause the damage.


I am just stumped by these things.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2018, 09:26:49 AM by FearlessAZ »
2010 Non PP Sho. All the factory goodies. (RIP)


2015 MKS Ecoboost. All the factory goodies.

Offline SHOdded

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #67 on: December 10, 2018, 09:31:05 AM »
AFAIK, strictly a dumb light based on yes/no to a set, expected oil pressure level.  Couldn't tell you the finer details re how that works though, there is an acceptable range because pressure will vary by temperature, rpm, etc.  Have to look-see if there is info in the shop manual about it.

For a 3.5L NA engine
Oil pressure  Minimum 30 psi @ 1,500 rpm with engine at normal operating temperature 

For a 2.0EB engine
Oil pressure (hot @ 2,000 rpm)  200 kPa (29.01 psi) - 268 kPa (38.87 psi) 

For a 3.5L EB engine
Oil pressure  Minimum 30 psi @ 1,500 rpm with engine at normal operating temperature 
« Last Edit: December 10, 2018, 09:33:59 AM by SHOdded »
2007 Ford Edge SEL, Powerstop F/R Brake Kit, TXT LED 6000K Lo & Hi Beams, W16W LED Reverse Bulbs, 3BSpec 2.5w Map Lights, 5W Cree rear dome lights, 5W Cree cargo light, DTBL LED Taillights

If tuned:  Take note of the strategy code as you return to stock (including 3 bar MAP to 2 bar MAP) -> take car in & get it serviced -> check strategy code when you get car back -> have tuner update your tune if the strategy code has changed -> reload tune -> ENJOY!

Offline FearlessAZ

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #68 on: December 10, 2018, 09:54:38 AM »
So it is based on oil pressure and not on level?


Would make a little sense why it didn't come on right away
2010 Non PP Sho. All the factory goodies. (RIP)


2015 MKS Ecoboost. All the factory goodies.

Offline SHOdded

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #69 on: December 10, 2018, 09:59:29 AM »
That is my understanding yes.  Could have been a faulty EOP switch ... or not.  The oil pump could be WAY too good at its' job ... or not.  Many possibilities.

The wiring diagram shows a) normal pressure, b) low pressure, but NO c) high pressure ...

This is a list of DTCs to show you just how far down the food chain input from this switch is

PCM DTC Chart
DTC        Description
P0125    Insufficient Coolant Temp For Closed Loop Fuel Control
P0128    Coolant Thermostat (Coolant Temp Below Thermostat Regulating Temperature)
P0504    Brake Switch A / B Correlation
P0512    Starter Request Circuit
P0532    A/C Refrigerant Pressure Sensor A Circuit Low
P0533    A/C Refrigerant Pressure Sensor A Circuit High
P0562    System Voltage Low
P0563    System Voltage High
P0572    Brake Switch A Circuit Low
P0573    Brake Switch A Circuit High
P0602    Powertrain Control Module Programming Error
P0605    Internal Control Module Read Only Memory (ROM) Error
P0620    Generator Control Circuit
P0625    Generator Field Terminal Circuit Low
P0626    Generator Field Terminal Circuit High
P0645    A/C Clutch Relay Control Circuit
P0657    Actuator Supply Voltage A Circuit/Open
P065B    Generator Control Circuit Range/Performance
P06E9    Engine Starter Performance
P0705    Transmission Range Sensor A Circuit (PRNDL Input)
P0706    Transmission Range Sensor A Circuit Range/Performance
P0708    Transmission Range Sensor A Circuit High
P0709    Transmission Range Sensor A Circuit Intermittent
P0710    Transmission Fluid Temperature Sensor A Circuit
P0711    Transmission Fluid Temperature Sensor A Circuit Range/Performance
P0712    Transmission Fluid Temperature Sensor A Circuit Low
P0713    Transmission Fluid Temperature Sensor A Circuit High
P0715    Turbine/Input Shaft Speed Sensor A Circuit
P0717    Turbine/Input Shaft Speed Sensor A Circuit No Signal
P0718    Turbine/Input Shaft Speed Sensor A Circuit Intermittent
P0720    Output Shaft Speed Sensor Circuit
P0721    Output Shaft Speed Sensor Circuit Range/Performance
P0722    Output Shaft Speed Sensor Circuit No Signal
P0729    Gear 6 Incorrect Ratio
P072C    Stuck in Gear 1
P072E    Stuck in Gear 3
P072F    Stuck in Gear 4
P0733    Gear 3 Incorrect Ratio
P0734    Gear 4 Incorrect Ratio
P0735    Gear 5 Incorrect Ratio
P073A    Stuck in Gear 5
P073B    Stuck in Gear 6
P0740    Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid Circuit/Open
P0741    Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid Circuit Performance/Stuck Off
P0742    Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid Circuit Stuck On
P0743    Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid Circuit Electrical
P0744    Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid Circuit Intermittent
P0748    Pressure Control Solenoid A Electrical
P0750    Shift Solenoid A
P0751    Shift Solenoid A Performance/Stuck Off
P0752    Shift Solenoid A Stuck On
P0753    Shift Solenoid A Electrical
P0755    Shift Solenoid B
P0756    Shift Solenoid B Performance/Stuck Off
P0757    Shift Solenoid B Stuck On
P0758    Shift Solenoid B Electrical
P0760    Shift Solenoid C
P0761    Shift Solenoid C Performance/Stuck Off
P0762    Shift Solenoid C Stuck On
P0763    Shift Solenoid C Electrical
P0765    Shift Solenoid D
P0766    Shift Solenoid D Performance/Stuck Off
P0767    Shift Solenoid D Stuck On
P0768    Shift Solenoid D Electrical
P0770    Shift Solenoid E
P0771    Shift Solenoid E Performance/Stuck Off
P0772    Shift Solenoid E Stuck On
P0773    Shift Solenoid E Electrical
P0774    Shift Solenoid E Intermittent
P0960    Pressure Control Solenoid A Control Circuit/Open
P0962    Pressure Control Solenoid A Control Circuit Low
P0963    Pressure Control Solenoid A Control Circuit High
P0973    Shift Solenoid A Control Circuit Low
P0974    Shift Solenoid A Control Circuit High
P0976    Shift Solenoid B Control Circuit Low
P0977    Shift Solenoid B Control Circuit High
P0979    Shift Solenoid C Control Circuit Low
P0980    Shift Solenoid C Control Circuit High
P0982    Shift Solenoid D Control Circuit Low
P0983    Shift Solenoid D Control Circuit High
P1285    Cylinder Head Overtemperature Condition
P1299    Cylinder Head Overtemperature Protection Active
P1464    A/C Demand Out Of Self Test Range
P1594    Forced Engine Shutdown - Remote Start System Fault, No Unattended Vehicle Timeout
P1595    Forced Engine Shutdown - Remote Start System Fault, Transmission Range Not In Park Position
P161A    Incorrect Response from Immobilizer Control Module
P1635    Tire/Axle Out of Acceptable Range
P1636    Inductive Signature Chip Communication Error
P1639    Vehicle ID Block Corrupted, Not Programmed
P163E    Transmission Control Module Programming Error
P163F    Transmission ID Block Corrupted, Not Programmed
P1700    Transmission Indeterminate Failure (Failed to Neutral)
P1702    Transmission Range Sensor Circuit Intermittent
P1703    Brake Switch Out Of Self Test Range
P1705    Transmission Range Circuit Not Indicating Park/Neutral During Self Test
P1711    Transmission Fluid Temperature Sensor Out Of Self Test Range
P1744    Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid Circuit Performance
P1780    Transmission Control Switch (O/D Cancel) Circuit Out Of Self Test Range
P1783    Transmission Overtemperature Condition
P1910    Reverse Lamp Control Circuit/Open
P193D    Cruise Control Multi-Function Input Signal
P2535    Ignition Switch Run/Start Position Circuit High
P2700    Transmission Friction Element A Apply Time Range/Performance
P2701    Transmission Friction Element B Apply Time Range/Performance
P2702    Transmission Friction Element C Apply Time Range/Performance
P2703    Transmission Friction Element D Apply Time Range/Performance
P2704    Transmission Friction Element E Apply Time Range/Performance
P2705    Transmission Friction Element F Apply Time Range/Performance
P2783    Torque Converter Temperature Too High
U0104    Lost Communication With Cruise Control Module
U0129    Lost Communication With Brake System Control Module
U0300    Internal Control Module Software Incompatibility
All Other DTCs    ó

« Last Edit: December 10, 2018, 10:08:21 AM by SHOdded »
2007 Ford Edge SEL, Powerstop F/R Brake Kit, TXT LED 6000K Lo & Hi Beams, W16W LED Reverse Bulbs, 3BSpec 2.5w Map Lights, 5W Cree rear dome lights, 5W Cree cargo light, DTBL LED Taillights

If tuned:  Take note of the strategy code as you return to stock (including 3 bar MAP to 2 bar MAP) -> take car in & get it serviced -> check strategy code when you get car back -> have tuner update your tune if the strategy code has changed -> reload tune -> ENJOY!

Offline FearlessAZ

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #70 on: May 07, 2019, 08:29:55 AM »
Well, after lots of fighting with the dealership and back and forth, I decided to give up. Traded in the SHO and got 2015 MKs Ecoboost with all the options (will do another introduction thread).


The dealership just kept claiming they knew they filled it and they weren't responsible. Also kept saying that I wouldn't have made it that far.

Suing them was not an option because in the state of Arizona, in a negligence case, you can't sue for attorneys fees. So basically each lawyer I talked to said it would probably end up costing close to $10k just to go to trial with the dealership.
2010 Non PP Sho. All the factory goodies. (RIP)


2015 MKS Ecoboost. All the factory goodies.

Offline SM105K

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #71 on: May 07, 2019, 09:12:15 AM »
Well, after lots of fighting with the dealership and back and forth, I decided to give up. Traded in the SHO and got 2015 MKs Ecoboost with all the options (will do another introduction thread).


The dealership just kept claiming they knew they filled it and they weren't responsible. Also kept saying that I wouldn't have made it that far.

Suing them was not an option because in the state of Arizona, in a negligence case, you can't sue for attorneys fees. So basically each lawyer I talked to said it would probably end up costing close to $10k just to go to trial with the dealership.

For effs sake.  That is a really crappy situation.  The good thing is, the MKs is an upgrade.....
2013 SHO PP: AJPTurbo E30 Tune, GH Intercooler, UPR Catch Can, H&R Springs, Power Stop Brakes. Tune Only: 12.56@108.98, 391HP and 470TQ

2013 Focus ST: Ford Racing Tuned

Offline SHOdded

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Re: Random Misfires 2010 NonPP SHO, Diagnosis -- No Oil in Engine
« Reply #72 on: May 07, 2019, 10:30:50 AM »
Royally sucks, can't say this was inevitable knowing the substandard legal options :(. Congrats on the MKS!
2007 Ford Edge SEL, Powerstop F/R Brake Kit, TXT LED 6000K Lo & Hi Beams, W16W LED Reverse Bulbs, 3BSpec 2.5w Map Lights, 5W Cree rear dome lights, 5W Cree cargo light, DTBL LED Taillights

If tuned:  Take note of the strategy code as you return to stock (including 3 bar MAP to 2 bar MAP) -> take car in & get it serviced -> check strategy code when you get car back -> have tuner update your tune if the strategy code has changed -> reload tune -> ENJOY!

 

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