• Welcome to Ecoboost Performance Forum. Please log in or sign up.
collapse

PTU Vent Filter

Started by SHO9987, November 18, 2017, 10:04:03 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

SHO9987

About a week ago I noticed some burning/gear oil smell coming from the car after spirited runs.  Even though ford serviced the PTU and replaced the seals about 10k miles ago I figured I would have it checked again anyway.  Brought it to a local transmission shop and had them drain, refill with royal purple, and replace the vent tube with a longer tube that I can zip tie higher up in the engine bay.  They said my PTU fluid was nasty and burnt for sure, like it has been overheating (they didn't think my PTU was long for this world). 

I thought this was a little odd for 10k miles after a service.  So, that night I took a look at the new vent tube with the old filter still on it.  I popped off the filter to trim down some of the extra tube and re-secure it in the engine bay. When I took the filter off I got a hiss of air from the PTU (obviously under pressure from the gas/heat).  Upon closer inspection of the filter it was completely clogged with PTU sludge.  The design of this vent/filter is odd to me, will attach pics as soon as I can.  I cleaned it out the best I could, but it does not seem like it will vent any gas/heat at all.  Maybe the white membrane/rubber piece is normally supposed to be permeable, but it certainly does not let much through when it's gummed up with PTU sludge.  Perhaps this is contributing to the PTU overheating?

This vent is supposed to vent the excess heat/gas out of the PTU correct? 

Would it be more efficient to put like a mini breather filter on the end of the vent tube instead? 

Has anyone else noticed this vent/filter clogged on their ecoboost?   

I haven't noticed any other adverse effects (no grinding, or groaning, or other weird noises) coming from the PTU, I'm hoping I caught it in time.  Definitely planning on more frequent PTU fluid changes for sure. 
2013 SHO Non-PP, Catless DPs, Custom 2.5" exhaust, Airraid CAI, Stock Turbo Upgrades, snow - W/M system, custom tune

SHO9987

Pic of the vent/filter with the cap removed.
2013 SHO Non-PP, Catless DPs, Custom 2.5" exhaust, Airraid CAI, Stock Turbo Upgrades, snow - W/M system, custom tune

SHO9987

Quick update:
I went to ford to see how much a new vent/filter would cost (approx 21 bucks).  One of the service guys there told me the sole purpose of the vent is to obviously release the excess heat and gasses that are created in the PTU to prevent it from over heating and over pressurizing and damaging the seals (hence why ford had to previously replace my PTU seals under warranty, unfortunately they didn't replace the clogged vent while they were at it). 

I decided to give a mini breather filter a chance.  Like I said, I had my transmission shop replace the short tubing with longer 5/16" tubing so I could access the vent easier in the engine bay.  From there I trimmed down a universal connector and used a couple of clamps to secure the mini breather filter in place.  I kept it tucked in the back of the engine to protect it from any splashing water, the engine cover protects it nicely. 

I wish I had some hard data to compare before and after temps of the PTU.  But I can say for sure the burning smell is gone now which I think is the biggest indicator.   
2013 SHO Non-PP, Catless DPs, Custom 2.5" exhaust, Airraid CAI, Stock Turbo Upgrades, snow - W/M system, custom tune

SHO9987

Update: I have since added a drain plug to the PTU and am in the process of 4-5 fluid changes over the next couple thousand miles, each with a small amount of ATF to help desludge the PTU.  As for the vent/filter above, still going strong.  No puking and no more burning smell since I've started servicing the PTU myself. 
2013 SHO Non-PP, Catless DPs, Custom 2.5" exhaust, Airraid CAI, Stock Turbo Upgrades, snow - W/M system, custom tune

SilvererSHO

Quote from: SHO9987 on January 03, 2018, 07:12:39 PM
Update: I have since added a drain plug to the PTU and am in the process of 4-5 fluid changes over the next couple thousand miles, each with a small amount of ATF to help desludge the PTU.  As for the vent/filter above, still going strong.  No puking and no more burning smell since I've started servicing the PTU myself.


I've seen it mentioned here a few times that guys are using some sort of solvent or ATF to remove the sludge.  Does anyone know for a fact that the sludge remains after doing just fluid changes as I've done?  I find it hard to believe that the sludge won't come out after a few fluid changes.  My thought is that it's not like it's a valve cover, the gear oil is being tossed around pretty hard in there by gears traveling at high speed in a small area and I'd rather have a small amount of sludge remaining that have a small amount of solvent or ATF remaining.
All Silver(er)SHO.  2012, every option with PP running new Firehawk Indy 500's.

SHO9987

QuoteI've seen it mentioned here a few times that guys are using some sort of solvent or ATF to remove the sludge.  Does anyone know for a fact that the sludge remains after doing just fluid changes as I've done?  I find it hard to believe that the sludge won't come out after a few fluid changes.  My thought is that it's not like it's a valve cover, the gear oil is being tossed around pretty hard in there by gears traveling at high speed in a small area and I'd rather have a small amount of sludge remaining that have a small amount of solvent or ATF remaining.

I am on my 3rd flush with about 20% ATF fluid mixed in.  The fluid is still dark as can be when I drain it, I think that is a sign of all the sludge that is still in there.  I have not noticed any adverse affects of the ATF fluid, car is running better then it ever has.  The changes are a lot easier and quicker with a drain plug though.  I am able to leave the drain plug out and flush it out with new fluid when I do the changes to get as much of the old stuff out as possible.  The first couple of times I would get chunks of sludge out that were sitting in the bottom.  The next two changes will be with 100% 75w-140 and then I will probably change the fluid once a year with an oil change from there on out. 

With that being said, I think it depends on how bad your PTU is/was.  My very first PTU drain was pretty bad (little to no actual fluid).  I think the ATF definitely helped clear out the sludge.  If your fluid still actually resembled fluid when you drained it then I don't think you would need to worry about "desludging" your PTU with ATF or solvents.

Most of my knowledge came from this read: http://www.fordedgeforum.com/topic/10914-ptu-leak-failures/#entry89270. I also read through most all the pages on this forum about PTU flushing and installing the drain plug ect. I think there are some small channels and passages that can get gummed up if the fluid is real bad.  Take a look at some of the pictures of the PTU that was pulled from that ford edge.  I didn't pulled mine off, but I have a feeling it would have looked very similar if I did.
2013 SHO Non-PP, Catless DPs, Custom 2.5" exhaust, Airraid CAI, Stock Turbo Upgrades, snow - W/M system, custom tune

SHOdded

Gear oil has no detergents, ATF does.  That's about the main difference.  And of course ATF is significantly thinner than gear oil.
2007 Ford Edge SEL, Powerstop F/R Brake Kit, TXT LED 6000K Lo & Hi Beams, W16W LED Reverse Bulbs, 3BSpec 2.5w Map Lights, 5W Cree rear dome lights, 5W Cree cargo light, DTBL LED Taillights

If tuned:  Take note of the strategy code as you return to stock (including 3 bar MAP to 2 bar MAP) -> take car in & get it serviced -> check strategy code when you get car back -> have tuner update your tune if the strategy code has changed -> reload tune -> ENJOY!

SilvererSHO

Quote from: SHO9987 on January 03, 2018, 10:38:08 PM
QuoteI've seen it mentioned here a few times that guys are using some sort of solvent or ATF to remove the sludge.  Does anyone know for a fact that the sludge remains after doing just fluid changes as I've done?  I find it hard to believe that the sludge won't come out after a few fluid changes.  My thought is that it's not like it's a valve cover, the gear oil is being tossed around pretty hard in there by gears traveling at high speed in a small area and I'd rather have a small amount of sludge remaining that have a small amount of solvent or ATF remaining.

I am on my 3rd flush with about 20% ATF fluid mixed in.  The fluid is still dark as can be when I drain it, I think that is a sign of all the sludge that is still in there.  I have not noticed any adverse affects of the ATF fluid, car is running better then it ever has.  The changes are a lot easier and quicker with a drain plug though.  I am able to leave the drain plug out and flush it out with new fluid when I do the changes to get as much of the old stuff out as possible.  The first couple of times I would get chunks of sludge out that were sitting in the bottom.  The next two changes will be with 100% 75w-140 and then I will probably change the fluid once a year with an oil change from there on out. 

With that being said, I think it depends on how bad your PTU is/was.  My very first PTU drain was pretty bad (little to no actual fluid).  I think the ATF definitely helped clear out the sludge.  If your fluid still actually resembled fluid when you drained it then I don't think you would need to worry about "desludging" your PTU with ATF or solvents.

Most of my knowledge came from this read: http://www.fordedgeforum.com/topic/10914-ptu-leak-failures/#entry89270. I also read through most all the pages on this forum about PTU flushing and installing the drain plug ect. I think there are some small channels and passages that can get gummed up if the fluid is real bad.  Take a look at some of the pictures of the PTU that was pulled from that ford edge.  I didn't pulled mine off, but I have a feeling it would have looked very similar if I did.


All good points.  After reading your link maybe I need to re-think flushing mine.  Thanks for the link.
All Silver(er)SHO.  2012, every option with PP running new Firehawk Indy 500's.

TimmyATL

Ok since I have been changing my PTU fluid since 14k miles and I have about 6 fluid changes. Each time the dark grey gets less and less and this last time I had nothing on my plug the fluid was light grey and fluid was also transparent. Also it still smelled like rear diff fluid. But since I have a 13PP I back fill with a pump through the drain plug take in fluid loss when I go to put the plug back in. But last year and even last week after I pumped In the fluid and took my adapter I made out to install the plug. The fluid came out and went everywhere. So I let it drain again, cleaned up the underneath and decided to do it the way the Ford manual says. so I was able to move the the PTU temp sensor shield and made a socket to break loose the temp sensor (note that I took out my downpipes to install the cat converters so I could pass emissions) and I filled it that way. I was talking to a coworker about it and he asked if I replaced the vent. I said no because I had the new one already on it. He said they are cheap just replace it. Then he told me about the vent. So I have one now and will be replacing it tonight and I will see what the screen looks like. Yall might want to extend the vent tube and make it part of your maintenance routine.
13 SHO PP, Airaid intake, 170 T-stat, 3bar map sensor, Ecopower Parts hot side pipes, Turbosmart 7lb wastegate actuators, Stainless Works catted downpipes, Corsa cat back exhaust with Loudvalves exhaust dumps, Alky Control Meth Injection, LMS Dyno Meth tune. TSW Nurburgring  with NItto NTO5

ecoboostsho

So I have a 13PP as well and in the past have removed the downpipes...however the "fill" through the drain plug idea intrigues me except I can see some inherent challenges.  What I was wondering is do you think it would be feasible to buy a Fumoto type oil drain valve and replace the drain plug in the PTU?  You could get the kind with the hose nipple and then just "reverse fill" through that and rather then try and get the plug in to it after filling and hoping a ton doesn't leak out in the process you could just flip the valve closed and call it good... thoughts?  Does anyone know what the diameter/thread pitch etc of the PTU plug is?

As an example... http://www.fumotousa.com/parts.php?partname=F107N&partnumber=34
2013 White SHO w/PP, Gearhead Tuned, 3 Bar, 160T, Plugs...Mess with the Bull and you'll get the Horn. :)
Previous 2011 Tuxedo Black SHO w/PP - 12.89 1/4 Mile

ecoboostsho

Never mind answered my own question...search was actually helpful! :)

According to Crash...
the drain plug is 1/4"- 18 NPTF
2013 White SHO w/PP, Gearhead Tuned, 3 Bar, 160T, Plugs...Mess with the Bull and you'll get the Horn. :)
Previous 2011 Tuxedo Black SHO w/PP - 12.89 1/4 Mile

SHO9987

Quote from: ecoboostsho on January 24, 2018, 01:29:32 PM
So I have a 13PP as well and in the past have removed the downpipes...however the "fill" through the drain plug idea intrigues me except I can see some inherent challenges.  What I was wondering is do you think it would be feasible to buy a Fumoto type oil drain valve and replace the drain plug in the PTU?  You could get the kind with the hose nipple and then just "reverse fill" through that and rather then try and get the plug in to it after filling and hoping a ton doesn't leak out in the process you could just flip the valve closed and call it good... thoughts?  Does anyone know what the diameter/thread pitch etc of the PTU plug is?

As an example... http://www.fumotousa.com/parts.php?partname=F107N&partnumber=34

I refill through the plug on the side of the PTU.  I also drilled and tapped a drain plug into the bottom.  I suppose you could probably fit that drain valve in, but I would not replace the original drain/fill plug on the side of the PTU with it.  It has a magnet to catch any metal debris and when you're done draining, you use that plug as the marker for how much gear oil to add.  With the car level, add oil into the fill plug on the side of the PTU, once the gear oil starts leaking out, you're full.  Wipe away the excess and replace the plug. 

I would admit, having the drain valve tapped into the bottom of the PTU might be nice... even easier and less messy probably that way. 
2013 SHO Non-PP, Catless DPs, Custom 2.5" exhaust, Airraid CAI, Stock Turbo Upgrades, snow - W/M system, custom tune

ecoboostsho

Quote from: SHO9987 on January 24, 2018, 02:27:38 PM
Quote from: ecoboostsho on January 24, 2018, 01:29:32 PM
So I have a 13PP as well and in the past have removed the downpipes...however the "fill" through the drain plug idea intrigues me except I can see some inherent challenges.  What I was wondering is do you think it would be feasible to buy a Fumoto type oil drain valve and replace the drain plug in the PTU?  You could get the kind with the hose nipple and then just "reverse fill" through that and rather then try and get the plug in to it after filling and hoping a ton doesn't leak out in the process you could just flip the valve closed and call it good... thoughts?  Does anyone know what the diameter/thread pitch etc of the PTU plug is?

As an example... http://www.fumotousa.com/parts.php?partname=F107N&partnumber=34

I refill through the plug on the side of the PTU.  I also drilled and tapped a drain plug into the bottom.  I suppose you could probably fit that drain valve in, but I would not replace the original drain/fill plug on the side of the PTU with it.  It has a magnet to catch any metal debris and when you're done draining, you use that plug as the marker for how much gear oil to add.  With the car level, add oil into the fill plug on the side of the PTU, once the gear oil starts leaking out, you're full.  Wipe away the excess and replace the plug. 

I would admit, having the drain valve tapped into the bottom of the PTU might be nice... even easier and less messy probably that way.
Do you have a 13+ PP with the PTU cooler? I believe the 13 Performance package already has a drain plug built in to the bottom. I would just be replacing it with the drain valve. They make an adapter for 1/4- 18 threads to a F107 valve. I have to get under the car to verify everything will physically fit. Also on the PP you can't get to the side fill plug without removing the down pipe thanks to the cooler and extra parts. My 11 had just the side fill plug so I understand what you are saying - I believe the PP is different is all.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

2013 White SHO w/PP, Gearhead Tuned, 3 Bar, 160T, Plugs...Mess with the Bull and you'll get the Horn. :)
Previous 2011 Tuxedo Black SHO w/PP - 12.89 1/4 Mile

TimmyATL

I will let yall know after I pass emissions and reinstall my down pipes I  plan on changing the fluid again. Once it is changed and I Reinstall my downpipes. I will see if I am able to get on the one bolt of the heat shield nearest the temp sensor. Then I will see if the socket I made can fit in and crack the sensor loose with the down pipes in .
13 SHO PP, Airaid intake, 170 T-stat, 3bar map sensor, Ecopower Parts hot side pipes, Turbosmart 7lb wastegate actuators, Stainless Works catted downpipes, Corsa cat back exhaust with Loudvalves exhaust dumps, Alky Control Meth Injection, LMS Dyno Meth tune. TSW Nurburgring  with NItto NTO5

SHO9987

Quote from: ecoboostsho on January 24, 2018, 02:32:04 PM
Quote from: SHO9987 on January 24, 2018, 02:27:38 PM
Quote from: ecoboostsho on January 24, 2018, 01:29:32 PM
So I have a 13PP as well and in the past have removed the downpipes...however the "fill" through the drain plug idea intrigues me except I can see some inherent challenges.  What I was wondering is do you think it would be feasible to buy a Fumoto type oil drain valve and replace the drain plug in the PTU?  You could get the kind with the hose nipple and then just "reverse fill" through that and rather then try and get the plug in to it after filling and hoping a ton doesn't leak out in the process you could just flip the valve closed and call it good... thoughts?  Does anyone know what the diameter/thread pitch etc of the PTU plug is?

As an example... http://www.fumotousa.com/parts.php?partname=F107N&partnumber=34

I refill through the plug on the side of the PTU.  I also drilled and tapped a drain plug into the bottom.  I suppose you could probably fit that drain valve in, but I would not replace the original drain/fill plug on the side of the PTU with it.  It has a magnet to catch any metal debris and when you're done draining, you use that plug as the marker for how much gear oil to add.  With the car level, add oil into the fill plug on the side of the PTU, once the gear oil starts leaking out, you're full.  Wipe away the excess and replace the plug. 

I would admit, having the drain valve tapped into the bottom of the PTU might be nice... even easier and less messy probably that way.
Do you have a 13+ PP with the PTU cooler? I believe the 13 Performance package already has a drain plug built in to the bottom. I would just be replacing it with the drain valve. They make an adapter for 1/4- 18 threads to a F107 valve. I have to get under the car to verify everything will physically fit. Also on the PP you can't get to the side fill plug without removing the down pipe thanks to the cooler and extra parts. My 11 had just the side fill plug so I understand what you are saying - I believe the PP is different is all.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

Gotcha, yeah I'm non-pp.  I see what you're saying now about refilling through the drain plug.  I figure that's doable as long as you're confident in the amount of fluid you're putting back in.
2013 SHO Non-PP, Catless DPs, Custom 2.5" exhaust, Airraid CAI, Stock Turbo Upgrades, snow - W/M system, custom tune