Meth weird power behavior (renamed from meth failure)

[TopherSho]

Did you get datalogs when it failed? I would say it's a testament to AJPTurbo's tune that your meth failed and your motor didn't pop!


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*sort of*

If you check my AJP meth experience thread I mention weird meth behavior after it sat for 17 days with 70% meth in it.. well I now think that's was the 1st sign.  At 70% meth it was degrading the diaphragm.. but it still operated once you made a hard run.  I data logged it doing its delay and posted it and sent one to brad.

Then I raced it since it felt fine after getting past that flutter.  At that time I was thinking air in the lines from not having a check valve.   it ran all night like a champ!  got a new best time and all that.

Next morning after sitting for 8 hours with 100% meth it was *done*.. green light would turn amber,  and after 3 more short tests it went all yellow and amber and the car bucked hard.

I would say in my form the AJP tune is saving the car from damage for sure!   now i will roll the tune back to my last non-meth favorite,  try to get a warranty replacement and send the car to the shop.  hopefully when i get the car back this coming friday i will have a new pump that is 100% meth safe and just swap it in and flip back to meth tune#3.

fingers crossed.

[TopherSho]

So some quick research is showing if you want to replace the valves and diaphragm in that snow pump, you can run pure meth... the new valve/diaphragm is this one I believe?

http://www.pumpvendor.com/Shurflo_94-390-06.html

Chances are the valve/diaphragm got dissolved enough that its leaking and not able to build pressure so that part will need to be replaced anyway...

Then switch out the lines for braided without plastic fittings and you could be good to go... might be worth looking a Devils Own for fittings and lines...

I would get the pump model and call sureflo just to verify... it could be relatively inexpensive to convert your setup over to support 100 meth..

Good luck with getting them to work warranty with you! If you bought it from them you should be OK. If you purchase it for the less than the MSRP from another reseller they will not honor any warranty.




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So am here, ( http://www.pumpvendor.com/Shurflo_8008-943-839_parts.html ) but cannot see any of the 'details'?   i cant verify if it support pure meth,  the browser (ff,chrome,IE) flashes and closes the page ..

have to call them to make sure.

[StealBlueSho]

So some quick research is showing if you want to replace the valves and diaphragm in that snow pump, you can run pure meth... the new valve/diaphragm is this one I believe?

http://www.pumpvendor.com/Shurflo_94-390-06.html

Chances are the valve/diaphragm got dissolved enough that its leaking and not able to build pressure so that part will need to be replaced anyway...

Then switch out the lines for braided without plastic fittings and you could be good to go... might be worth looking a Devils Own for fittings and lines...

I would get the pump model and call sureflo just to verify... it could be relatively inexpensive to convert your setup over to support 100 meth..

Good luck with getting them to work warranty with you! If you bought it from them you should be OK. If you purchase it for the less than the MSRP from another reseller they will not honor any warranty.




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So am here, ( http://www.pumpvendor.com/Shurflo_8008-943-839_parts.html ) but cannot see any of the 'details'?   i cant verify if it support pure meth,  the browser (ff,chrome,IE) flashes and closes the page ..

have to call them to make sure.

Not sure, but this thread has a lot of good information from guys with SP pumps that have crapped out on 100% meth...

http://www.3si.org/forum/#/topics/379968?page=4



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[bpd1151]

Perplexed to still see suggestions at alternate pumps/vendors......

I'll reiterate, a proven, consistent performer.....  Alky-Controls.

Stop beating yourself up and just do it. Headaches, worries, concerns etc. all done with.

Did I mention Alky-Controls?

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[SHOdded]

i hear voices in my head moaning "Allllkkkkyyyyy" "Alllllllllllllllllllllkyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy" o yea!

[StealBlueSho]

Perplexed to still see suggestions at alternate pumps/vendors......

I'll reiterate, a proven, consistent performer.....  Alky-Controls.

Stop beating yourself up and just do it. Headaches, worries, concerns etc. all done with.

Did I mention Alky-Controls?

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I agree 100% with your assessment. There were a platitude of reason I personally chose Alky Control. TopherSho is having an issue obviously and being able to remedy his issues with under $150 in parts is an option vs dropping $900 on a new kit.

If the OP doesn't have heart burn buying another meth kit then Alky Control is a great option, and there has only been one pump failure as far I know on our platform with BPD1151 drawing that lucky straw.

Just trying to provide alternatives...

If it was my car, knowing I have a meth dependent tune, and want to maximize my performance with 100% meth, I wouldn't think twice about dropping the money on Alky Control. Cheaper than a new motor!

The OP IMHO is damn lucky the SP pump didn't crap out in the middle of a 1/4 mile run this time around or this thread would have a different more expensive resolution.


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[TopherSho]

Thanks for all the feedback guys!

So here is my two thoughts..

As SBS noted I can call sureflow and see about replacing the internals with 100% meth rated components.  If that's possible I will go that route since I'm all set for the rest of the hardware minus the braided lines.

What I need to figure out is how the error light works on the snow kit, if the pump is 'dumb' and is on off. I might just buy and drop in a similar psi rated alky pump..

As to blowing up the motor.. would 6 points if timing really do that? I'm not sure.. I can run 20 pts spark on just 92 gas,. If the pump fully stopped mid run I'd be 6 points over spark..

[StealBlueSho]

Thanks for all the feedback guys!

So here is my two thoughts..

As SBS noted I can call sureflow and see about replacing the internals with 100% meth rated components.  If that's possible I will go that route since I'm all set for the rest of the hardware minus the braided lines.

What I need to figure out is how the error light works on the snow kit, if the pump is 'dumb' and is on off. I might just buy and drop in a similar psi rated alky pump..

As to blowing up the motor.. would 6 points if timing really do that? I'm not sure.. I can run 20 pts spark on just 92 gas,. If the pump fully stopped mid run I'd be 6 points over spark..

There have been a motors that have blown up when guys run of out meth. Its not so much the total spark I would be worried about... it's how fast your knock sensors can relay back to the ECU so it can start pulling timing... it's really a race against the clock.. are you running more boost with less throttle control? Your meth is also supplementing your fuel system as well... lots of factors. If it's a conservative meth tune you might be ok... again... just depends on variables.


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[StealBlueSho]

Thanks for all the feedback guys!

So here is my two thoughts..

As SBS noted I can call sureflow and see about replacing the internals with 100% meth rated components.  If that's possible I will go that route since I'm all set for the rest of the hardware minus the braided lines.

What I need to figure out is how the error light works on the snow kit, if the pump is 'dumb' and is on off. I might just buy and drop in a similar psi rated alky pump..

As to blowing up the motor.. would 6 points if timing really do that? I'm not sure.. I can run 20 pts spark on just 92 gas,. If the pump fully stopped mid run I'd be 6 points over spark..

There have been a motors that have blown up when guys run of out meth. Its not so much the total spark I would be worried about... it's how fast your knock sensors can relay back to the ECU so it can start pulling timing... it's really a race against the clock.. are you running more boost with less throttle control? Your meth is also supplementing your fuel system as well... lots of factors. If it's a conservative meth tune you might be ok... again... just depends on variables.


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[TopherSho]

are you running more boost with less throttle control? Your meth is also supplementing your fuel system as well... lots of factors. If it's a conservative meth tune you might be ok... again... just depends on variables.

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I would say i'm running a moderately aggressive Meth build.   Brad was explaining the controls in place and how fast it can adjust,  i would defer to him to explain it better than I.

[TopherSho]

well now i'm flumoxxed.  Snow is claiming the LED does not change color and has only one element.   but that doesn't solve the pump pressure issue so now I am off to make a recorded call to the support staff and press the issue of the pump.

wish me luck..

however this does solve one mystery,  if the pump has no logic,  and the green led is just a green led then i should be able to drop in a replacement pump running the same pressure and re-use the exiting kit.


###################################################################################
From: Snow Performance Tech [mailto:tech@snowperformance.net]
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 8:41 AM
To: Chris Beeck <cbeeck@symantec.com>
Subject: Re: [EXT] Re: Is the stage 1 100% meth compatible? IE run 100% meth no water ? thanks in advance!

Hi Chris,

it does look like it has some different colors - I dont know if that is relating to heat in the circuit or something else , but i can assure you the LED is simply meant to come on when the pump is active , there are not alarm colors in that light.
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###################################################################################
From: Snow Performance Tech [mailto:tech@snowperformance.net]
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2017 8:27 AM
To: Chris Beeck <cbeeck@symantec.com>
Subject: Re: [EXT] Re: Is the stage 1 100% meth compatible? IE run 100% meth no water ? thanks in advance!

Hi Chris,
The pump is able to run pure methanol - all parts are designed for this.
The green LED is not designed to turn color - if it is showing up as yellow this may be the green coloring fading or burning - it may be a bad LED running hot and overheating the coloring or the coloring did not cure properly and is fading. The light changing color is not indication of pump failure so we dont need to worry about that.
I would be happy to get a new LED light to you - we have never had one turn color before.
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[TopherSho]

I have a email into Alky,  i am asking about the specs of their pump.   amperage, psig.   if it lines up with the snow pump I may opt to buy their pump and replace the snow one with it,  then call sureflow and repair the current pump...

[TopherSho]

Snow called me,  either they are super awesome at bs'ing,  or they really do support 100% meth.  I attached the audio recording.

They think the LED is burning out,  and is unrelated.  the LED only has the one element and is not a error light.
The contact very firmly stated 100% meth is fine for the pump
They do recommend replacing the lines at about a year if you run more than 50% meth
They asked to 12v test the pump and report back.

my thoughts::
I wonder ... does meth getting into the boost reference line have bad effects?
Is there is issue with the pressure switch itself?
did having back pressure from no check valve cause the diaphragm to become malformed?

It sounds like there willing to help if i can prove the pump is not working as designed.    i will get 20 feet of line and have the pump push a bunch of water through it,  then let sit overnight and retest.   if that works i will then push 8/9 pounds of pressure BACK UP the output line and retest again. 

Audio file is 3gp as recorded by my app   sorry no wave or mp3 option.

[J-Will]

Perplexed to still see suggestions at alternate pumps/vendors......

I'll reiterate, a proven, consistent performer.....  Alky-Controls.

Stop beating yourself up and just do it. Headaches, worries, concerns etc. all done with.

Did I mention Alky-Controls?

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

didnt your alky pump fail?  I thought you discovered that all pumps have a life span, and are going to fail at some point. 

[bpd1151]

Perplexed to still see suggestions at alternate pumps/vendors......

I'll reiterate, a proven, consistent performer.....  Alky-Controls.

Stop beating yourself up and just do it. Headaches, worries, concerns etc. all done with.

Did I mention Alky-Controls?

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

didnt your alky pump fail?  I thought you discovered that all pumps have a life span, and are going to fail at some point.

Yes. It did.

They average 2.5-3yrs (no matter mfg'er) according to Julio, owner of Alky-Controls.

And given the amount of meth I pump through mine, certainly a helluva longer duration than what is being reported as experiences here from Snow.

Plus, from what's been reported previously by others, Snow has terrible product support, and their warranty coverage leaves something to be desired.

Which, all combined, leads me right back to my recommendation of Alky-Controls.

Stellar all around. In every facet.

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