A Question for LME on VTA

[EcoPowerParts]

Well these cars are speed density so no MAF so no issues there. As it's an auto you don't have engagement of the BoV during acceleration like a stick car due to lifting of the throttle. The cars notated are definitely stick vs our auto. I think it's a matter of hey those have ecoboost and this has an ecoboost so it must be the same.
I don't care either way, just want proof for the general population. There's no vendor slant to this request just hey if you're going to say it then prove it and this is a pretty big statement IMHO.

[SHOdded]

Could the "sound effect" be replicated by having a metal pipe in place instead of doing the VTA?  Similar to how the K&N intake sounds louder due to the metal pipe?  Is heatsoak critical on the BOV?

[SHOnUup]

Well these cars are speed density so no MAF so no issues there. As it's an auto you don't have engagement of the BoV during acceleration like a stick car due to lifting of the throttle. The cars notated are definitely stick vs our auto. I think it's a matter of hey those have ecoboost and this has an ecoboost so it must be the same.
I don't care either way, just want proof for the general population. There's no vendor slant to this request just hey if you're going to say it then prove it and this is a pretty big statement IMHO.

First...I respect all your info and efforts to push this platform forward. Without your efforts we'd be years behind still.

Second....I've only heard of and have quit reading anything here pertaining to the differences between certain parties. I DON'T CARE...I just like cars and want everyone to succeed.

When you comment on issues, it should carry added weight being the owner and parts supplier.

When MDESIGN brings out new CAI and handicaps a known performance killing CAI in comparison to tout 15 HP gain, I'd expect a comment in there wanting more testing at least to tout these #'s on my site.

I still feel MDesign CAI is the best one for us, but if there's no solid data needed here, why is it needed elsewhere.

I guess it's the consistency I'm looking for.

Rich

[EcoPowerParts]

Well these cars are speed density so no MAF so no issues there. As it's an auto you don't have engagement of the BoV during acceleration like a stick car due to lifting of the throttle. The cars notated are definitely stick vs our auto. I think it's a matter of hey those have ecoboost and this has an ecoboost so it must be the same.
I don't care either way, just want proof for the general population. There's no vendor slant to this request just hey if you're going to say it then prove it and this is a pretty big statement IMHO.

First...I respect all your info and efforts to push this platform forward. Without your efforts we'd be years behind still.

Second....I've only heard of and have quit reading anything here pertaining to the differences between certain parties. I DON'T CARE...I just like cars and want everyone to succeed.

When you comment on issues, it should carry added weight being the owner and parts supplier.

When MDESIGN brings out new CAI and handicaps a known performance killing CAI in comparison to tout 15 HP gain, I'd expect a comment in there wanting more testing at least to tout these #'s on my site.

I still feel MDesign CAI is the best one for us, but if there's no solid data needed here, why is it needed elsewhere.

I guess it's the consistency I'm looking for.

Rich

Sorry Rich, I didn't see those statements, I just saw this one. I've been working 5:30 until 2:30 day job and 3pm until 11pm M-F and Sat 6a to 10p getting new shop ready, getting cars read for an event this last weekend etc. I try to read as much as I can and post where I can. I'd love to see dyno's proving any CAI making more HP, it would definitely validate the product.

[Livernois Motorsports]

We wanted to go through and add some clarity on this. First of all, let us be straight. An atmospheric BOV in and of itself does not impact the power output, however there are a few things that we look at long term here. It was worded poorly on our part, which is why we want to clear it up. #1, while they seem simple to install, they often times are not and we have had numerous instances where they created issues because of improper install. This can of course be said with just about anything, but the BOV is in integral part of the logic in the ECM. There is indeed a reasoning for this, and going pure mechanical is taking a step backwards in technology. If you are chasing sound, that's perfectly fine, but it's not something we recommend as we take it upon ourselves to only recommend products that add to the performance of these cars.

Now, in addition to the possibility of improper install, you do have to take into account the fact that to install this, would require the introduction of metal charge pipes. This is also a technological step backwards. With the constraints of the engine bay, and the fact that there is already a great deal of heat being generated in a tight space, the hard piping associated with an atmospheric BOV is the real root cause of degraded performance.

So, in summary. No, it was phrased incorrectly on our part, an atmospheric BOV does not inhibit power or performance. BUT, it adds nothing, and the other aspects needed to install one makes us feel that it is a step backwards in performance, and technology. Which these two items are what makes the EcoBoost platforms so appealing in the first place, so this is the core to why we do not recommend them.

[EcoPowerParts]

I've definitely said for the entire time I did the write up on using the stock BoV with factory tubing that it gains nothing, I'm glad you cleared that up, no power is going to be lost from doing this on our cars.
The pipes I made was to fix an issue of the factory pieces coming apart under high boost in AZ, plastic and rubber doesn't live long here, I've also stated on those pipes no power will be gained.

[SHOnUup]

Would there be a possibility while brake boosting at the tree and you go past your desired rpm's and let off throttle slightly to get back down in the range wanted causing a VTA condition?

Rich

[EcoPowerParts]

Would there be a possibility while brake boosting at the tree and you go past your desired rpm's and let off throttle slightly to get back down in the range wanted causing a VTA condition?

Rich

Dropping rpms slightly won't cause it to open, just a full lift from my experience at the track.

[ZSHO]

In general when there is a cut in throttle,the pressurized air needs somewhere to go,when recirculated,the air is reused and sent back to the air intake(and goes through the process again),because of this your ECU /tune is expecting this recirculated air,when you vent this pressurized air to the atmosphere,your throwing it away when the ECU is expecting it,this obviously causes stability issues,there no beneficial point to running  a VTA bov setup,other than sound,if you really want sound,you can get it from your CAI,personally think its degrading to sacrifice performance/stability just for sound,this is only my opinion.

[EcoPowerParts]

In general when there is a cut in throttle,the pressurized air needs somewhere to go,when recirculated,the air is reused and sent back to the air intake(and goes through the process again),because of this your ECU /tune is expecting this recirculated air,when you vent this pressurized air to the atmosphere,your throwing it away when the ECU is expecting it,this obviously causes stability issues,there no beneficial point to running  a VTA bov setup,other than sound,if you really want sound,you can get it from your CAI,personally think its degrading to sacrifice performance/stability just for sound,this is only my opinion.

Unfortunately this is incorrect on our cars, the ECU is speed density and works off of different calcs than a MAF car does.

[SHOnUup]

I've been intrigued by the VTA option ever since a srt4 neon pulled up messing with me letting the VTA do some work. Sounded pretty cool.

Rich

[navbtcret]

I find no real heat soak with the pipes either. I really like LMS and use their tunes and have no desire to go anywhere else. The metal pipes do not really see anymore heat soak than the plastic and once you get moving it is gone, just like the plastic. I really do not like the sound of the aftermarket BOV but that is the nature of buying something used for a good price as preventative maintenance.

Not really sure how you can mess up installing this either, it is pretty straight forward.

[Livernois Motorsports]

Our testing on metal pipes has show drastically different results, but we also test things much further than most people do. We are talking about more than just ACT, but actually measuring at multiple points, and seeing what kind of impact it has at high boost limits and the build up and transfer of heat.

We have never had issues with the stock pipes coming apart, regardless of the conditions they are under. Michigan see's plenty of 100+ degree days, plus our dyno cell has the ability to get much hotter than this. There was only one car we have ever replaced a pipe on and it was definitely a fluke as no other cars, regardless of boost level, have ever ran into an issue.

[EcoPowerParts]

We have never had issues with the stock pipes coming apart, regardless of the conditions they are under. Michigan see's plenty of 100+ degree days, plus our dyno cell has the ability to get much hotter than this. There was only one car we have ever replaced a pipe on and it was definitely a fluke as no other cars, regardless of boost level, have ever ran into an issue.

I bet things rust there but your rubber on your windows lasts for years? Here we don't get rust but the rubber is dried out in 3-5 years on cars, my daughter's 2001 pickup all the seals needed replacing due to dry rot.
Sorry to debate this but you don't live here so you don't have even an understanding of what the dry heat does to the rubber components on cars, heck even our batteries only last 18 months at best due to them drying out (the non-serviceable ones)

[SHOdded]

I guess you get a lot of low-humidity, high-heat days, Mike?