Testing Air Oil seperators

ShoBoat · April 11, 2014, 10:37:20 AM

Sorry SHOdded, I feel I need to answer SwampRat, as I trully respect him and pretty much all the guys on here. Like I said I have nothing agains RX. I did not mean to sound condescending to Tracy. They don't have any good data on this system on a SHO, the only install that we know of has 0 stuff in their can. I stated questions on the function of their system. Which I still have doubts about the reduction of flow and the long runs of hoses to make it work in our cars. Also the location of the can just above the exhaust manifold to me is questionable. You really need the can to be cooler than the air passing through it for max effect. Otherwise you are not going to get any condensing effect. I like the RX it has done wonders for the f150. But we don't drive the f150.

ShoBoat · April 11, 2014, 10:42:36 AM

Quote from: SwampRat on April 11, 2014, 10:33:01 AM
ShoBoat ... the basis off concern here is that the whole issue was on the argument that Livernois advised against any OCC and you were in agreement after learning so .Based on your " faith " in what you were told you still decided on this latest experiment .
That is puzzling to me ...

Livernois will more than likely never explain there reasoning to the forum .

Yes I was curious and somewhat concerned especially since I all ready have the RX .
I as well post information that I learn from vendors here.

That's what I believe that this is all about, interesting enough. I called a local engine builder this morning and they are against catch cans also? Weird. And you are correct when they told me I got freaked out and posted it here. I respect you for speaking your mind. Not everyone does, debate is healthy. It's all good.

Ps I decided on this experiment so I can make up my own mind. Faith can only get you so far. And after Tracys posts (and great responses) it got me curious. Hence here we are.

ShoBoat · April 11, 2014, 10:55:24 AM

So on to the test, I am planning to pull the system apart on Sunday and post the results.

SwampRat · April 11, 2014, 11:14:03 AM

One week of testing ... NYC and back .
I don't see much from just a few miles ... ahead with testing though .

Constructive criticism and debate is good for all here.

BiGMaC · April 11, 2014, 11:25:08 AM

Quote from: ShoBoat on April 11, 2014, 10:55:24 AM
So on to the test, I am planning to pull the system apart on Sunday and post the results.

Excellent! Thanks for all your work on this issue.

68_GT · April 11, 2014, 11:30:34 AM

I wonder who has the highest mileage SHO on here and any input about this thay may have ? I know when I changed out my 3bar MAP on the upper intake it had a tad bit of oil dripping from the one I removed. I hate to spend the money on something unecessary, but I sure don't want my engine gunked up either. I plan to keep mine for a long time.

crash712us · April 11, 2014, 01:38:07 PM

The alternative, if your want to keep valves from coking up would be regular scheduled maintenance. Such as B&G service or 3m fuel system cleaning at least every 15k.

IHeartGroceries · April 11, 2014, 01:52:42 PM

The intake manifold looks pretty simple to yank off.
I don't see why the valves can't be cleaned at home. And of course, the intake tract and intercooler can be cleaned easily.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

SHOdded · April 11, 2014, 01:55:33 PM

IHeartGroceries, do I sense a "How-To" in the making? Hint, hint

BTW, is the intake manifold 1 piece or 2 pieces? We have a 2 pc on the Edge.

SwampRat · April 11, 2014, 02:33:49 PM

Quote from: SHOdded on April 11, 2014, 01:55:33 PM
IHeartGroceries, do I sense a "How-To" in the making? Hint, hint BTW, is the intake manifold 1 piece or 2 pieces? We have a 2 pc on the Edge.

Intake manifold on the transverse is one piece .

Shodded , I have a confession to make . Before I bought my SHO I was looking hot n heavy at the 13 Edge but as you know and I found out while looking , there is no 3.5 EB for it .... sigh ..... wish they could shoehorn one it to it .

Just really like the looks of the Edge .

ShoBoat · April 11, 2014, 02:36:04 PM

Damn can u imagine an Edge sport with the 3.5eb? That would be a hoot to drive!

SHOdded · April 11, 2014, 02:56:59 PM

It's pretty fun with the base 3.5L actually, but we have been pushing for the 3.5EB for some time

Trying to keep my foot out of it to keep the MPGs high, soooo tempting!!! Rumors are though that the V6 will meet its demise in favor of the smaller 4-banger EBs, maybe a 2.5L (makes me glad to have my V6)!

There have been a couple of one-off turbo projects, one private and one for SEMA, but nothing even close to the wondrous EB motor.

Official Moroso Air/Oil Separator video for the V:
Moroso TV: Moroso Air/Oil Separator / Catch Can test 2009 Cadillac CTS-V www.moroso.com

Independent user review on a Mustang:
Moroso Oil Catch Can Review - 2013 Mustang GT

BiGMaC · April 11, 2014, 03:26:42 PM

Well, while it's not a SHO... my daughter in law's Edge sport is pretty spirited and is a truly fun cross-over to drive.

Manu... I fear your right about the V6... I too am glad i have it and hope Ford will continue to develop it. BUT, if they don't the objective things we learn from all these little experiments we do become ever more important!.......Like this thread on Testing Oil Separators

ShoBoat · April 13, 2014, 11:13:22 AM

Ok so after about 500km I pulled the units off the car, and guess what I found? Nothing! when I mean nothing I mean nothing nada not even dirty. I wiped the units down to see if they had any residue on the inside and it was clean? Now either these are the worst catch cans ever or possibly I haven't given it enough time. But I expected to find something at least a bit of residue. See the attached pics, this has got me wondering. During the Ecoboost torture test, they ran that thing at full boost for pretty much 24 hours right? You would think that that poor engine would be running on oil after just a few miles. Unless they faked it? I am starting to wonder if most of the oil that we are seeing in the throttle body and intake is coming from leaky turbo seals and not the PCV system. According to ford "some oil" is normal coming from the turbo seals. I had cleaned the intake manifold 2 weeks ago and I am not seeing any evidence of oil behind the throttle body where the inlet is from the rear PCV port. But I did see evidence of oil on the TB? I will continue to run the catch cans for another 3 weeks. I think I might pull the tube off my rear turbo and see if there is evidence of oil there. This would be up stream of the "clean side" and would be impossible to get anything from the PCV back there.

Or one other thing, I am running 1/2 tube and fittings throughout. I wasn't crazy about the reduction in flow for the stock 3/8 fittings that the kit came with. The stock hose and fittings is 1/2.

SwampRat · April 13, 2014, 11:42:58 AM

I wouldn't expect much of anything in only 310 miles of testing .

It has been conclusively proven that the PCV system on the SHO and other DI engines contributes to the detrimental inherent issues that DI engines have .
I have stated that the torture test / tear down video that Ford uses is nothing more than a marketing tool and I love my Ford's.

Just as many here have done the the BOV VTA ( no no says EPA ) the only way to eliminate the deposits and harm associated with PCV systems is to use some type of containment system or vent the crankcase to air . This could be done ....... Not an ideal solution but for off road , its common place .

BG's real world 60,000 mile testing of there company owned 2010 SHO proves this .

http://www.bgprod.com/bgfueltest/

Perhaps longer testing on your part may show accumulation , my guess is even though the Moroso cans MAY not be the ideal choice ; the plumbing choice or PCV routing needs to be reconsidered .

You MAY end up with accumulation results with this test with more time and driving .
Weather or not this oil is bulding up from leaky turbo seals or a poorly designed PCV system or a combination of the two , you still have a need to remove it from the intake CAC and associated plumbing to prevent these harmfull deposits and other internal component damage from occuring .

I plan on keeping my SHO a VERY long time and anything I can do to keep things purring is worth the investment .

Tracy readily admits there are SOME OCC's on the market that are good ones but most are garbage.
I appreciate his honesty but most of us here are not knowledgeable enough to buy one from whomever else and hook the plumbing up correctly .

Tracy at RX did a fix as he determined the initial install on painterpats Flex by him was faulty . We will see soon whether or not this has been remedied , I think it will end up with possitive results .
His F150 system works as stated , I think its simply a matter of working out the bugs .